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  #401  
Old 12-30-2010, 05:33 AM
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Well, one thing's for sure; rearnakedchoke has a lively thread going here...
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  #402  
Old 12-30-2010, 05:34 AM
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Just to add to my last post...we are all boxing/MMA fans...

and WHO ultimately runs these sports?

The government...
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  #403  
Old 12-30-2010, 06:31 AM
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Sorry...they owned slaves...can't take them, or that document, totally serious. I don't mean to sound ignorant or uneducated, it's just how I see it.

Also, saying we need an agency like the FBI is NOT saying a person agrees with Obamacare...or ANY sort of nationalized heath-care...

Which is sort of what I've been trying to say since this came up....Agreeing with some sort of centralized oversight in certain respects doesn't make you a "certified" socialist anymore than it means you "hate America" for wanting to see an agency that puts bad guys away be abolished...

See what I'm sayin? Or should I stick to Boxing and MMA?
You do realize that many of the authors of the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution were some of the earliest anti-slavery activists? It was a huge issue back then and many didn't think that the statement "all men are created equal" was compatible with the institution of slavery. However, it was so controversial that it threatened to tear the country apart before it got started. So they decided to just allow each state to set it's own laws concerning slavery and, for the sake of unity, they would let future generations deal with the contradiction.

To say that the ownership of slavery by some of the Founding Fathers somehow negates the authority and credibility of the Constitution is one of the stupidest and most anti-American statements I've ever read.
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  #404  
Old 12-30-2010, 06:35 AM
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Originally Posted by J.B. View Post
Just to add to my last post...we are all boxing/MMA fans...

and WHO ultimately runs these sports?

The government...
MMA fan, yes. Boxing? Not so much.

The government regulates the institutions that run these sports. They don't directly run the sports. There is a difference.

Even if your statement was true, then what is your point? Because the government supposedly controls boxing and MMA, then we should allow them to have total authority over every aspect of our lives?
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  #405  
Old 12-30-2010, 06:44 AM
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You do realize that many of the authors of the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution were some of the earliest anti-slavery activists? It was a huge issue back then and many didn't think that the statement "all men are created equal" was compatible with the institution of slavery. However, it was so controversial that it threatened to tear the country apart before it got started. So they decided to just allow each state to set it's own laws concerning slavery and, for the sake of unity, they would let future generations deal with the contradiction.

To say that the ownership of slavery by some of the Founding Fathers somehow negates the authority and credibility of the Constitution is one of the stupidest and most anti-American statements I've ever read.
Yes, I do realize that, and it almost DID tear the country apart during the civil war...

My point in bringing that up was only to address Chris's assertions about the constitution and the founding fathers. I don't think we should assume that everything interpreted by a mind over 200 years ago automatically applies to every single generation. Unless of course we are talking about God, and I highly doubt any of the founding fathers of America were, in fact, God.

The fact is, there WERE slave owners who wrote the constitution, and it IS a living document that is meant to change with the times. My only question/dispute in all of this has been the usefulness/constitutionality of the FBI...

I agree with FBI, Chris does not... what does Nate say?
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  #406  
Old 12-30-2010, 06:49 AM
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MMA fan, yes. Boxing? Not so much.

The government regulates the institutions that run these sports. They don't directly run the sports. There is a difference.

Even if your statement was true, then what is your point? Because the government supposedly controls boxing and MMA, then we should allow them to have total authority over every aspect of our lives?
The Government does control both sports...split heirs all you want... These sports are regulated assault. I don't suppose you will tell me I am wrong about that too?

No, Nate, I am not a socialist for pointing out what is a FACT. I am simply pointing out that everybody who sits on here complaining about the government having too much control over our lives also follows a sport that is controlled by the government.
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  #407  
Old 12-30-2010, 07:18 AM
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Originally Posted by J.B. View Post
Yes, I do realize that, and it almost DID tear the country apart during the civil war...

My point in bringing that up was only to address Chris's assertions about the constitution and the founding fathers. I don't think we should assume that everything interpreted by a mind over 200 years ago automatically applies to every single generation. Unless of course we are talking about God, and I highly doubt any of the founding fathers of America were, in fact, God.

The fact is, there WERE slave owners who wrote the constitution, and it IS a living document that is meant to change with the times. My only question/dispute in all of this has been the usefulness/constitutionality of the FBI...

I agree with FBI, Chris does not... what does Nate say?
No, the Founding Fathers were not GOD, but they entrusted GOD to guide them while writing the Constitution. While I would never claim that the Constitution was divinely inspired, I will say that it employs Godly principles that will NEVER change.

So I do not ascribe to this ridiculous notion that the Constitution is a "living document" that needs to be reinterpreted every few generations. That's basically saying that the Constitution is irrelevant.

When I joined the Army, I swore to protect and defend the Constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic. The meaning was clear: anyone who opposed the authority of the US Constitution was an enemy of the US Army.

I haven't really given the issue of the FBI much thought, however, I would tend to agree with Chris F on this one.

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Originally Posted by J.B. View Post
The Government does control both sports...split heirs all you want... These sports are regulated assault. I don't suppose you will tell me I am wrong about that too?

No, Nate, I am not a socialist for pointing out what is a FACT. I am simply pointing out that everybody who sits on here complaining about the government having too much control over our lives also follows a sport that is controlled by the government.
Your point being?

Do the referees control the fighters in the octagon? No, they merely regulate their actions. Do the state governments control MMA? No, they merely regulate the sport within the boundaries of their jurisdiction.

Interpret the facts however you want, it doesn't make it truth.
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  #408  
Old 12-30-2010, 07:40 AM
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Your point being?

Do the referees control the fighters in the octagon? No, they merely regulate their actions. Do the state governments control MMA? No, they merely regulate the sport within the boundaries of their jurisdiction.

Interpret the facts however you want, it doesn't make it truth.
Okay...I'm just a crazy socialist hippie..

Go ahead and try and hold an organized MMA event without getting licenses from the government...

ACTUALLY, I know a place you CAN do that...It's called an Indian Reservation....LOL

Arguing over the term "regulate" or "control" is silly. You know who has the bottom line say in regulation (the Government) and how it directly impacts the sport.

Should we get into how letting each state individually regulate Boxing/MMA has helped F**K up these sports? It took until the year 2000 to get federal reform that helped stop a lot of the BS that was going on in Boxing with promoters, but because everything in Washington needs to be down the letter, MMA missed the boat...

But I suppose me suggesting there should be some sort of central oversight on ANY aspect of this world would make me a "certified socialist"? I mean heaven forbid we all agreed on SOMETHING....RIGHT?
...
FACT...MMA/Boxing is run by the government, and even Dana White said so...

Last edited by J.B.; 12-30-2010 at 07:49 AM.
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  #409  
Old 12-30-2010, 07:53 AM
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Okay...I'm just a crazy socialist hippie..
You're the one who keeps saying it, not me.
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  #410  
Old 12-30-2010, 08:00 AM
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You're the one who keeps saying it, not me.
I'm a boxing guy...I know when people are cherry picking and avoiding tough opponents...
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