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  #11  
Old 05-26-2010, 04:18 AM
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You think he doesn't want to? He can't Ben. Duh.

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Originally Posted by VCURamFan View Post
I agree with you completely. One piece of business advice I'd offer to GSP, though: better advertising for your brand. By this I mean: FINISH YOUR FIGHTS DECISIVELY & QUICKLY!!! As a fighter, the best way to advertise yourself is with a HL reel. If GSP went back to finishing guys instead of decisioning them, he'd become an even more marketable commodity.
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  #12  
Old 05-26-2010, 11:49 AM
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Originally Posted by J.B. View Post
Actually, the best way to market yourself as a fighter is by winning. Getting a KO is great, but it's just a bonus. Winning is top priority.

Hello? Floyd Mayweather anybody?

All the hardcore fans complain about him not finishing fights too, and then the mainstream eats him up. He's made more money in the last 5 years than most of us will see in 10 lifetimes.
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Originally Posted by J.B. View Post
I agree with what you said here. I have been saying that for a long time. It's why I have always been critical of the current model that MMA operates under, especially for the top guys in the sport.

However, what VCU said was that the most important thing for a fighter is a highlight reel, and that's not the case. Which is why I eluded to Floyd Mayweather. A fighter doesn't have to "finish" every single fight in order to build their resume and become very successful inside and outside of the ring. Ultimately, it is LOSING fights that will set a fighter back in their career, which is why winning the fights is the top priority. Same goes for any athlete in any sport. In Basketball, you play to win the NBA Championship, it doesn't matter if you win it in game 7 by 1 point, or if you win by sweeping the competition. You play to win.

Sure, you do need some other things outside of fighting skills when it comes to marketing, but ultimately it boils down to being a champion that keeps sponsors and advertisers around for athletes. Being the champion is equated with being the best in the business, and that will always sell, even if some champions are not as exciting as others.

Also, in the case of GSP, he is hardly having any problems handling his business. A couple of hard core fans being overly critical of a few fights isn't going to make or break a fighter at that level.
I think you & I agree more than you may think, J.B. Obviously you need to win. If it seemed as though I was saying that a HL is more important than a W, then I did a poor job of communicating my point. However, I believe that my point is still valid: Marketing by winning = A; Marketing by finishing = A+. Allow me to quote you:
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Getting a KO is great, but it's just a bonus. Winning is top priority.
That's means that it's an added positive on top of winning, correct? Thus making it better that "just" winning.

I agree that winning is the top priority, however, when presented with a choice between winning safely & winning spectacularly, the latter would make for better marketing. This is my opinion.
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  #13  
Old 05-26-2010, 02:46 PM
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guys like the diaz bros, tito, king mo, babalu, crazy horse bennett etc are all about image in my opinion. The "bad boy, all I wanna do is fight image". Even when they loose fights they are pushing that line.

fighters that just want to fight - Matt Hughes, Nate marquardt, Patrick Cote, Mark Munoz, Hendrickson etc (not that I'm a fan of all of them). To me these guys view themselves as athletes first and especially in the ring. When they are out of the ring they put some effort toward their other job of marketing themselves, or better yet delegate that task.

An athlete worries about winning within the rules, an image cares more about how his perfomance affects his career win or loose.
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  #14  
Old 05-26-2010, 04:07 PM
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Originally Posted by VCURamFan View Post
I think you & I agree more than you may think, J.B. Obviously you need to win. If it seemed as though I was saying that a HL is more important than a W, then I did a poor job of communicating my point. However, I believe that my point is still valid: Marketing by winning = A; Marketing by finishing = A+. Allow me to quote you:
That's means that it's an added positive on top of winning, correct? Thus making it better that "just" winning.

I agree that winning is the top priority, however, when presented with a choice between winning safely & winning spectacularly, the latter would make for better marketing. This is my opinion.
I do agree with you, and yes getting a finish is a "bonus" to the actual victory, but it's really just for show. The meat and potatoes is in the actual wins. Again, not to beat a dead horse, but I will go back to the Mayweather example.

He has faced criticism for not finishing as many fights later in his career on a level that completely dwarfs GSP. For the last 6-7 years, critics of Floyd have beaten that same drum, to no avail. Floyd has still managed to make himself a household name despite those criticisms, and many others for that matter. You basically have to beat some so-called boxing fans over the head with the facts to convince them that Mayweather has actually faced tough competition, yet his career still thrives. Obviously a huge part of Mayweather's success is linked to his ability to work a microphone, but make no mistake, the moment that the first notch is marked in the "L" column for Floyd, a lot of the wind will be taken out of his hot-air balloon (if you get what I'm sayin)
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Old 05-26-2010, 04:15 PM
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Originally Posted by J.B. View Post
I do agree with you, and yes getting a finish is a "bonus" to the actual victory, but it's really just for show. The meat and potatoes is in the actual wins. Again, not to beat a dead horse, but I will go back to the Mayweather example.

He has faced criticism for not finishing as many fights later in his career on a level that completely dwarfs GSP. For the last 6-7 years, critics of Floyd have beaten that same drum, to no avail. Floyd has still managed to make himself a household name despite those criticisms, and many others for that matter. You basically have to beat some so-called boxing fans over the head with the facts to convince them that Mayweather has actually faced tough competition, yet his career still thrives. Obviously a huge part of Mayweather's success is linked to his ability to work a microphone, but make no mistake, the moment that the first notch is marked in the "L" column for Floyd, a lot of the wind will be taken out of his hot-air balloon (if you get what I'm sayin)
O yeah, I completely agree with you. Winning is paramount, and GSP will continue getting endorsements as long as he kepts getting Ws. I'm just saying that if he wants to move from UnderArmour/Gatorade/etc. up to Pepsi/Coke/etc., having some recent HLs may just help put him over the edge.
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Old 05-26-2010, 04:34 PM
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Originally Posted by VCURamFan View Post
O yeah, I completely agree with you. Winning is paramount, and GSP will continue getting endorsements as long as he kepts getting Ws. I'm just saying that if he wants to move from UnderArmour/Gatorade/etc. up to Pepsi/Coke/etc., having some recent HLs may just help put him over the edge.
Gatorade is owned by Pepsi. How often did we see Jordan selling Pepsi or Coke? Gatorade is basically the biggest beverage an athlete can be sponsored by. It's the UFC of beverage sponsorships in terms of athletes. There might be some better paying gigs out there, but a Gatorade sponsorship is still the place to be for athletes.

Under-Armour is a major player right now too, so I'd say GSP is pretty well off. He doesn't have a long-term deal with Nike at this point, but maybe one day.
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  #17  
Old 05-27-2010, 02:25 PM
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Originally Posted by J.B. View Post
Gatorade is owned by Pepsi. How often did we see Jordan selling Pepsi or Coke? Gatorade is basically the biggest beverage an athlete can be sponsored by. It's the UFC of beverage sponsorships in terms of athletes. There might be some better paying gigs out there, but a Gatorade sponsorship is still the place to be for athletes.

Under-Armour is a major player right now too, so I'd say GSP is pretty well off. He doesn't have a long-term deal with Nike at this point, but maybe one day.
I know, I know, I was just trying to make the differentiation between sport-specific sponsorships & over-arching sponsorships. You know, like Jordan also having Hanes, or Tiger having Mercedes. Neither of these really have anything to do with sports.
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  #18  
Old 05-27-2010, 03:16 PM
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Small window or not, deep inside some guys will put it on the line, some won't.
I really don't think it reflects style, if anything a riskier style getting losses has proved to make you a more liked name and bring more success.
(just stats, not opinion.)

Guys like Couture have horrible records, but huge gyms, followings, etc....
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  #19  
Old 05-27-2010, 03:18 PM
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Originally Posted by J.B. View Post
Gatorade is owned by Pepsi. How often did we see Jordan selling Pepsi or Coke? Gatorade is basically the biggest beverage an athlete can be sponsored by. It's the UFC of beverage sponsorships in terms of athletes. There might be some better paying gigs out there, but a Gatorade sponsorship is still the place to be for athletes.

Under-Armour is a major player right now too, so I'd say GSP is pretty well off. He doesn't have a long-term deal with Nike at this point, but maybe one day.
Pretty often.
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  #20  
Old 05-27-2010, 10:05 PM
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Originally Posted by rearnakedchoke View Post
people can get mad at GSP for wanting to get the W first, but they aren't paying his grocery bill .....
No...most of us dont have the luxury of being able to choose not to perform to the best of our abilities like Anderson Silva and Georges Saint Pierre.... most of us HAVE to take the risks of failiure, and we may still lose. We probably had less to begin with and probably less afterwards to

...and I wouldnt mention grocery bills to me if I were you. Georges would have to lose a significant amount of finance to compare to what some people who look to him for entertainment have to pay just to exist. When Georges Saint Pierre can not afford to keep a car on the road, when he spends half his income on keeping dilaphadated roof over his head...then I might take pity on the poor mite.

But he selfishly wants to keep something to himself, at the expense of hardworking people who pay to be entertained. Business?? lets talk about who the consumer is in all this, because it isnt GSP. Its people like me He is paid for a service...I expect what I pay for, if he is an awesome fighter with top notch skills...I expect to see an awesome display...I have paid for that privalage, and the UFC have promised to provide. That is Business.
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