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  #11  
Old 05-20-2010, 07:36 PM
Chris F
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Originally Posted by flo View Post
And for the record, there were 5 times the number of Union soldiers fighting against slavery than there were slave owners.
care to cite your source on this. The turth is most soliders in the North refused to fight for the "darkies" as they called them. This is why it was not a war aim in the start. Abe used the emanciaption proclamation (which frees no one btw) to incite the South and hope for a slave rebeliion which never came. MOst slaves in the South were treated really well and were taken care better then any Nortehrn factory worker. This idea the Civil War was about slavery is a myth perpetuated by stupid football coaches who teach history in schools. I worte my masters thessis on reace relation in the South and was amazed on the primary source I found and how most soldiers from the North were more racist then those in the South.
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  #12  
Old 05-20-2010, 07:40 PM
Chris F
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Originally Posted by Miss Foxy View Post
Oh brother!! My gosh whats wrong with these people? Get over it and move the funk on! Btw I was asked the other day if I am racist, because I have a 3leaf clover tattoo on my right foot.. I was like "ex-squeeze me?"... I am freakin' brown do I look like I am a white supremacist?!! I swear people need to put all the attention and energy of whining over racism and educate their "race".......
symbols get mistaken a lot. The clove is at times a sign of Irish pride and you get no whiter then that. Its sorta like all the idiots out there that assume a Confederate flag means hate and racism (thanks to hollywood) when it was the American flag that flew over the slave ships.
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  #13  
Old 05-20-2010, 10:08 PM
Blade
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This whole thing is just ridiculous, but while they're at it maybe the kin of slaves might also like to meet up with the kin of the African tribal chiefs who were responsible for selling a sizeable proportion of their own people to the white slave traders in the first place. Anyway, I'm off to daub offensive graffiti on the gravestone of my great great great grandfather as payback for him choosing such a crappy place for himself and future generations to live.
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  #14  
Old 05-20-2010, 10:39 PM
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Originally Posted by flo View Post
I am sick and tired of being portrayed as a victimizer simply because I'm white. I find THAT racist and offensive. Slavery was abolished 150 years ago.
Exactly. We have nothing to make amends for.

Most people don't realize that the very first attempt to abolish slavery in America was started in 1777, just one year after the signing of the Declaration of Independence. So, it's an issue that America was trying to solve from the very beginning.

What's also interesting is that the arguments that the slave-owners used to defend slavery are the same arguments that the Pro-Choice movement makes today to defend abortion (y'know that whole thing about "legislating morality").

Anyways, I have family members that were exterminated in Auschwitz, but do I feel that the citizens of modern Germany owe me anything at all? No. The blacks need to put slavery in the past and get over it.
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Old 05-20-2010, 11:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Shoots like a girl View Post
I agree, this is stupid. I owe only for MY OWN sins and those I have sinned against and no one else. There is nothing I can do to change the past. I have alot of african american friends and NONE of them feel I owe them anything other than that 5 bucks I borrowed from one of them today!
BUT we do pay for the sins of our fathers. If you look at the history of Israel, and what is mentioned about generations paying for what their forefathers did. Slavery was never called evil by God. The verse about Masters treating slaves well, and slaves being obediant comes to mind. However you can't declare yourself a nation of God in which all men are created equal, and keep slaves. That's when I would call it a sin.
The racial devide in this country is a way in which we pay for the sins of our forefathers.
That being said, pull up your pant's, speak propper english, and stop walking as slow as possible in front of my car. If you do these things I'll be less inclined towards racial slurs.
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  #16  
Old 05-20-2010, 11:56 PM
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I fact-check myself, ChrisF, you don't need to worry on that score. But just to be polite ~

http://www.civil-war.net/pages/1860_cens…
The Civil War Home Page
Results from the 1860 Census
Slaves: 3,950,528
Slaveholders: 393,975

http://www.civilwarhome.com/casualties.h…
The Price in Blood!
Casualties in the Civil War

The Union armies had from 2,500,000 to 2,750,000 men. Their losses, by the best estimates...
Total 360,222
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  #17  
Old 05-20-2010, 11:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Blade View Post
This whole thing is just ridiculous, but while they're at it maybe the kin of slaves might also like to meet up with the kin of the African tribal chiefs who were responsible for selling a sizeable proportion of their own people to the white slave traders in the first place.
Exactly.
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  #18  
Old 05-21-2010, 12:02 AM
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Shoot, I must have mucked up the URLs. Sorry.

If you really need me to find a link for you to back up those numbers I will. As for the intent of every Union soldier, of course I don't know what was in their mind. Neither does anyone else.
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  #19  
Old 05-21-2010, 12:04 AM
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Here is the correct link, sorry for so many consecutive comments...

http://www.civil-war.net/
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  #20  
Old 05-21-2010, 12:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Garandshooter View Post
BUT we do pay for the sins of our fathers. If you look at the history of Israel, and what is mentioned about generations paying for what their forefathers did. Slavery was never called evil by God. The verse about Masters treating slaves well, and slaves being obediant comes to mind. However you can't declare yourself a nation of God in which all men are created equal, and keep slaves. That's when I would call it a sin.
The racial devide in this country is a way in which we pay for the sins of our forefathers.
That being said, pull up your pant's, speak propper english, and stop walking as slow as possible in front of my car. If you do these things I'll be less inclined towards racial slurs.
"Fathers shall not be put to death for their children, nor children put to death for their fathers; each is to die for his own sin." (Deut. 24:16)

Slavery has existed for thousands of years and was pretty much just a fact of life back in Biblical times. However, it was not the institution that we think of today as slavery. Most forms of slavery were temporary and existed to allow the slaves to pay off debt (making todays' credit card industry the modern equivalent of slavery). Many people were also slaves by choice because they had served their masters for years and were released, but chose to stay in slavery to that master out of love.

It wasn't until Darwin's book, The Origin of Species, that slavery became a race issue. That's when the idea that some races were "sub-human" and were destined to serve (or be exterminated by) the "more evolved" races, was endorsed by the scientific community of the time.

So, the institution of slavery during George Washington's day was not the same institution that existed in Abraham Lincoln's day.
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