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Old 02-14-2010, 07:17 AM
AMJ
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I was having a discussion with a friend about religion and this scenario was presented. I would like to hear your take on the matter.

If two babies were born in two different countries and each country had a single dominant religion, how each child turns out is based on the family and country they were born into. In essence, Baby A is born in Country X and is exposed to 1 religion, whereas Baby B was born in Country Y and is raised in a different religion. Each are taught that that their religion is the correct one and is the only way to salvation.

Baby A and B would not have a choice in determining their belief system or the avenue that best speaks to them. How can you blame that child when it is growing up in an environment where he/she is only doing what their family is teaching them. When they grow older, there beliefs would obviously be of a visceral nature and not be so easy to just toss aside.

Baby A and B eventually grow into Adults, and they reinforce what they were taught to to their children, and the cycle continues.

The obvious conclusion is that it essentially comes down to where you are born and the family, and you as an individual cannot determine where you are born. Therefore, you are basically born into that religion and don't have much of a choice in the matter. So how can you ever have an opportunity to "join" the right team, or is it not about the right religion and just a matter of being a good person? I am curious to hear your take on the scenario and how your faith addresses it. I don't know the first thing to any religion, i'm just curious

Anyways, I look forward to hearing your responses. Sorry if this is the wrong place to post this, please move it to the appropriate section if need be.

AMJ

Last edited by AMJ; 02-14-2010 at 07:27 AM.
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Old 02-14-2010, 08:00 AM
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AWESOME POST!!!!!

I was brought up with alot of "folk theology" and wrong beliefs. And just like your story, I believed them and told others about them and spread them like I thought I was supposed to. Eventually I felt burdened to study the word for myself and found the real truths and continue to find them.
I know that this is just my case but I cant assure you that a question like this one and the ones that I am sure will come with it, will never be answered fully. I could be wrong and I hope and pray that I am, I would love to find answers to these arguments.

I am looking forward to the discussion to follow, but will most likely keep quiet.
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Old 02-14-2010, 08:12 AM
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Well, you seem to be working under the assumption that GOD is not real and all religions are false at their very core.

I would like to know your thoughts on GOD and the Bible before I go any deeper.
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Old 02-14-2010, 04:09 PM
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Well, you seem to be working under the assumption that GOD is not real and all religions are false at their very core.

I would like to know your thoughts on GOD and the Bible before I go any deeper.
Fair enough, i'll do my best to answer your inquiry. However, I don't think I implied that God isn't real or that any religion is absolutely false. My personal views on the matter is that I just don't know, and I won't refute or deny the existence of a God. As for the Bible, I've never studied it (nor other religions like Judaism, Hinduism, or Islam) and I do not proclaim to have any knowledge outside of the questions i've googled or asked to qualied people in my eyes.

Back to my point: I'm not questioning the legitimacy of any religion or the existence of God.I am just curious how your faith/opinion (i'm sure they are both strongly correlated) addresses the above scenario. I think a person has the right to choose to practice whatever religion that gives them peace and does not intrude on other's beliefs.

The premise of my post is that a person's religion is technically a by-product of where that person is born, and that person has no control over it. So, how could someone ever reach salvation if they never had a chance to be exposed to other religions, even if they did in my scenario, they most likely did at a superficial level.

Do you see where I am getting at? If not, i'll try and clarify if you pinpoint what you're not clear on from my post.
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Old 02-14-2010, 04:25 PM
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Originally Posted by AMJ View Post
If two babies were born in two different countries and each country had a single dominant religion, how each child turns out is based on the family and country they were born into. In essence, Baby A is born in Country X and is exposed to 1 religion, whereas Baby B was born in Country Y and is raised in a different religion. Each are taught that that their religion is the correct one and is the only way to salvation.

Baby A and B would not have a choice in determining their belief system or the avenue that best speaks to them. How can you blame that child when it is growing up in an environment where he/she is only doing what their family is teaching them. When they grow older, there beliefs would obviously be of a visceral nature and not be so easy to just toss aside.

Baby A and B eventually grow into Adults, and they reinforce what they were taught to to their children, and the cycle continues.

The obvious conclusion is that it essentially comes down to where you are born and the family, and you as an individual cannot determine where you are born. Therefore, you are basically born into that religion and don't have much of a choice in the matter. So how can you ever have an opportunity to "join" the right team, or is it not about the right religion and just a matter of being a good person? I am curious to hear your take on the scenario and how your faith addresses it. I don't know the first thing to any religion, i'm just curious
1. Satan wants us to think its all about being a "good person" but Romans 3:23 says that "all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God". Being a good person means nothing to God, for as it says in Isaiah 64:6 "All of us have become like one who is unclean,and all our righteous acts are like filthy rags; we all shrivel up like a leaf, and like the wind our sins sweep us away."

2. Look, man decided to depart from God. People who went wherever and decided to worship false idols, embedding false idolatry deep into their cultures...well, can't blame God for that. However, just because someone was born in the US, where there are 20 million churches, as opposed to India, where there are 200, doesn't mean that they cannot find the one true God. Each person has a soul. Every person searches for God, even you are searching. Looking for Him and seeking Him are different things. A person who grew up Hindu can certainly find God if he is seeking Him. God knows our heart. There are probably more Christians in China right now than there are in the U.S.
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Old 02-14-2010, 04:55 PM
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religion for the most part is a faith based product.....there is no proof one way or the other whether God exists or if Jesus ever actually walked the earth.
its the same for every other religion out there,there is no proof for anyone that any God that people wish to worship actually exists.
that is why you see different religions around the world.
as far as which God should people believe in ? well maybe pick the one that sends a compassionate message...not one that tells everyone to go out and kill in his name...pretty sure those one's are just not real.
we are all influenced by our different cultures in a very big way but at the end of the day common sense should help you decide if what you have been taught over the years is practical or not.
some people believe in God because they actually do think God is real,while others say they believe in God but really only to cover all their bases just in case God really does exist...dont be one of those.
religion is good and i hope you come to believe in God at some point in time buti think the most important thing is really just to be a good person
and treat EVERYONE you encounter in life with respect and things should work out just fine....for the most part anyway.
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Old 02-14-2010, 05:09 PM
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religion for the most part is a faith based product.....there is no proof one way or the other whether God exists or if Jesus ever actually walked the earth.
That's not true. There is evidence that Jesus lived. And so what if religion is faith based? Faith is the belief in the unseen. You have to have faith to believe in love right? You certainly can't see it can you?
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Old 02-14-2010, 05:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizion View Post
1. Satan wants us to think its all about being a "good person" but Romans 3:23 says that "all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God". Being a good person means nothing to God, for as it says in Isaiah 64:6 "All of us have become like one who is unclean,and all our righteous acts are like filthy rags; we all shrivel up like a leaf, and like the wind our sins sweep us away."

2. Look, man decided to depart from God. People who went wherever and decided to worship false idols, embedding false idolatry deep into their cultures...well, can't blame God for that. However, just because someone was born in the US, where there are 20 million churches, as opposed to India, where there are 200, doesn't mean that they cannot find the one true God. Each person has a soul. Every person searches for God, even you are searching. Looking for Him and seeking Him are different things. A person who grew up Hindu can certainly find God if he is seeking Him. God knows our heart. There are probably more Christians in China right now than there are in the U.S.
I like your post.
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Old 02-14-2010, 05:16 PM
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there is no proof one way or the other whether God exists or if Jesus ever actually walked the earth.
What about the Bible? Do you not believe anything in a book? Only the things you see with your eyes.
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Old 02-14-2010, 05:23 PM
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Originally Posted by AMJ View Post
Fair enough, i'll do my best to answer your inquiry. However, I don't think I implied that God isn't real or that any religion is absolutely false. My personal views on the matter is that I just don't know, and I won't refute or deny the existence of a God. As for the Bible, I've never studied it (nor other religions like Judaism, Hinduism, or Islam) and I do not proclaim to have any knowledge outside of the questions i've googled or asked to qualied people in my eyes.

Back to my point: I'm not questioning the legitimacy of any religion or the existence of God.I am just curious how your faith/opinion (i'm sure they are both strongly correlated) addresses the above scenario. I think a person has the right to choose to practice whatever religion that gives them peace and does not intrude on other's beliefs.

The premise of my post is that a person's religion is technically a by-product of where that person is born, and that person has no control over it. So, how could someone ever reach salvation if they never had a chance to be exposed to other religions, even if they did in my scenario, they most likely did at a superficial level.

Do you see where I am getting at? If not, i'll try and clarify if you pinpoint what you're not clear on from my post.
Okay, well we have to first clarify exactly what religion is. In essence all religions are manmade institutions that use spiritual principles to influence and guide actions here on Earth. So, if you are just looking for something to give you some semblance of inner peace and harmony with the people around you, then pretty much any religion that is the majority religion of the area you live in will accomplish that; but that has nothing to do with if those religions are true or not.

This is where Christianity breaks from the mold, because Jesus Christ was actually more concerned with our lives after we died, than here on earth. There were sermons about loving others and how to treat people well, but they were almost always punctuated with a warning of hellfire and torment for those who didn't listen. Jesus actually talked about Hell more than He talked about Heaven.

Jesus also warned of how His words would cause disharmony and strife even within families.

So, to say that the purpose of Christianity is to do good works, to help people, and to live in harmony with your fellow man would be inaccurate. The purpose of Christianity is to bring us into repentance and a personal relationship with GOD.

Anyways, back to your point. If these people in your example are just looking to live in harmony with others and only want to be known as good people, then whatever religion they choose will basically accomplish that simple goal. However, they are missing the point. How we behave here on earth is the byproduct of knowing GOD, not a path to GOD. In other words, you have to know GOD first, then the good works and charitable deeds follow afterwards. Religion has it backwards.

As CS Lewis put it, "Religion is man seeking God, Christianity is God seeking man."

If people are truly seeking a relationship with GOD, then no religion on earth is going to fill that need. And they will never find true happiness or inner peace until they get that personal relationship with GOD, no matter what religion they have chosen. This would apply to Christianity as well, since a vast majority of Christians have no personal relationship with GOD and think that they can somehow earn their way into Heaven with enough good works. They're essentially spitting in the face of Christ and telling Him that His sacrifice was not adequate and they can do better.

So, basically, if you only see religion as a form of social conditioning and mass manipulation, then they all essentially have the same goals. However, the hole that people try to fill with religion is too deep for any religion to fill. Only GOD can fill that need within us and He reveals Himself to whoever earnestly seeks Him, no matter what culture, nation or religion they have been raised under.
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