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  #21  
Old 02-16-2009, 09:31 AM
KENTUCKYREDBONE
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I don't have the same faith and Trust in Unions that you apparently do!
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  #22  
Old 02-16-2009, 10:56 AM
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Originally Posted by bradwright
he finished Matt,,

oh oh,,did i say that out loud?
Not in a title defence he didnt
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  #23  
Old 02-16-2009, 11:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Spiritwalker
Disagree... on the whole.. they are treated very good.. you don't see up and comers wanting to go to Affliction or somewhere else.. It's UFC. Well if it was so bad for the fighters, then no one would want to go there..

I would like to see some of my favorite fighters takes on that...

Hell.. even Tito is lobbying to get back in the UFC.. but that's cause no one wants him.
That will eventually change if they keep up their most recent maltreatment.

As for Unions...the reason noone wants one is because they are skeeeeerd that the Union might actually tell the UFC they cant do something. I know one of the things about America I dislike is that across the board most things have been de-unionized. This makes working a littttttttle bit unprotected because who do you have to turn to for help if you are wronged?

I believe that Wal-Mart is now completely de-unionized
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  #24  
Old 02-16-2009, 02:31 PM
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This country is way better off without Unions. All Unions do is bleed companies (reference dock workers and forklift drivers who make $30 an hour, that's bs) and promote the idea that people cannot speak for themselves.

I agree that things should be done better in the UFC without needing to completely form a Union. The fighters could certainly go on strike, then what would Dana do? I'm not big on strikes, but I could certainly understand the fighters, especially those at the bottom, needing better compensation for their fights. Those guys making $3000 a fight are just being wronged.
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  #25  
Old 02-16-2009, 03:11 PM
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Originally Posted by rockdawg21

1)This country is way better off without Unions. All Unions do is bleed companies (reference dock workers and forklift drivers who make $30 an hour, that's bs) and promote the idea that people cannot speak for themselves.

2) I agree that things should be done better in the UFC without needing to completely form a Union. The fighters could certainly go on strike, then what would Dana do? I'm not big on strikes, but I could certainly understand the fighters, especially those at the bottom, needing better compensation for their fights.

3) Those guys making $3000 a fight are just being wronged.
1) no its not. De-unionization promotes the idea that your workers can be abused like slaves.. "Cannot speak up for themselves" the sad fact is without a Union they absolutely cant! Why should the UFC pay any notice whatsoever to Mr Mohr for example? Why should they keep him? who can he possibly complain to? He and all those in the UFC have almost no voice at all. A union ensures that promotions like the UFC cant just hire and fire and play politics or treat their employees like cattle!!

2) Wait, thats what he would do. Because it wouldnt take long for the fighters to starve to death or be forced into other jobs. plus you'd need a united front. If ten fight camps went on strike, he'd find replacements. if they all went on strike he'd wait...within a month some of them would be forced back.

3) so I'm waiting for your better views. What good is it to point out an issue and no suggest an alternative? If not a Union...what? You gonna excercise YOUR voice and write to the UFC...do you think that would change their minds? A Union on the other hand will change their minds because a Union means EMPLOYMENT LAW is protected.

I feel VERY strongly about these sort of issues because I've been wronged in an area that is De-Unionized. I've experienced first hand what big Institutions think they can get away with when noone is watching them. Its criminal, no it actually IS criminal.
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  #26  
Old 02-16-2009, 04:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyburn
1) no its not. De-unionization promotes the idea that your workers can be abused like slaves.. "Cannot speak up for themselves" the sad fact is without a Union they absolutely cant! Why should the UFC pay any notice whatsoever to Mr Mohr for example? Why should they keep him? who can he possibly complain to? He and all those in the UFC have almost no voice at all. A union ensures that promotions like the UFC cant just hire and fire and play politics or treat their employees like cattle!!

2) Wait, thats what he would do. Because it wouldnt take long for the fighters to starve to death or be forced into other jobs. plus you'd need a united front. If ten fight camps went on strike, he'd find replacements. if they all went on strike he'd wait...within a month some of them would be forced back.

3) so I'm waiting for your better views. What good is it to point out an issue and no suggest an alternative? If not a Union...what? You gonna excercise YOUR voice and write to the UFC...do you think that would change their minds? A Union on the other hand will change their minds because a Union means EMPLOYMENT LAW is protected.

I feel VERY strongly about these sort of issues because I've been wronged in an area that is De-Unionized. I've experienced first hand what big Institutions think they can get away with when noone is watching them. Its criminal, no it actually IS criminal.
1) Why not complain to the source, Mr. White? When I was a teenager and if I had a problem with somebody, I confronted them. I didn't go to their mommy and daddy and ask them to handle the situation for me. A person could simply schedule an appointment to meet with him when he isn't busy. That's just a simple phone call and ask them guy for a few minutes of his time to express concerns, ask questions, etc.

2) If the UFC started bringing in a bunch of bums to head main events, nobody would buy them. It would be the demise of the UFC and the start of another organization. At least, that's how I feel.

3) It's like shopping at Wal-Mart, I don't agree with the way their workers are treated, but I still shop there because it saves me money. As long as the UFC keeps putting on fights that I enjoy watching, I'll keep buying PPV events and watching the shows on Spike. Like I said, fighters should speak up for themselves and go personally to Dana if they have any issues. I'm quite certain that Dana would respect them more if they brought the problems directly to him instead of going to the press or just complaining in radio shows and things like that. If they don't like the way the meeting was handled, they can go and fight elsewhere. Besides, Affliction is paying fighters much more than the UFC.

4) Sorry to hear what happened to you in your past. There are some companies who are quite large, like Wal-Mart, who I feel abuse their power. However, one thing I do know about Dana is he definitely would appreciate a guy who has the balls to confront him about issues and if they don't like the way Dana is handling it, they can leave.
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  #27  
Old 02-16-2009, 05:10 PM
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Originally Posted by rockdawg21
Not to mention, Frank Mir had an outside of the Octagon injury, he's came back and is now one of the top heavyweights in the world again.

Well, Frank was never cut from the UFC due to losing. It would be the same with any champion. "see you when you are healty" type of thing..
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  #28  
Old 02-16-2009, 05:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyburn
As for MW. Perhaps they should have let Anderson Silva actually work his way to the title. Then he wouldnt have spent so much time on top with nowt to do. Not that his performance verses Cote was half what he's capable of.

Dude.. Anderson (and I am not the fan boy) worked for his shot.. he came into the UFC from Pride (which Zuffa owns).. with something like a 15-4 record..was given a tune up fight.. against someone that had a lot of hype (Leban) and TKOed him. made sense to strike while the name was hot..

Quote:
GSP needs to finish a fight in a title defence before he even thinks of fighting anywhere outside of his division, and BJ Penn should stick to what he's good at and leave the big boys alone, grease or no grease..
No one is really pushing him to fight Anderson.. prolly cause Anderson couldn't cut to WW.. granted.. I would like to see that at a catch weight fight..

Quote:
2) Pro Wrestling has big numbers aswell. Want the sport to end up like that? You dont reward drug users and or cheats...so Bonnar should be dumped in exactly the manner that Sobral was....and the UFC brought in the TUFers now they must deal with the consequences.
Renato was dumped HARD for his actions in the cage.. Bonner just lost to a "nobody". Granted that Jones is a friend of a friend.. he still hasn't done much.. one on the way up.. (jones) and another on the way down (bonner)

Quote:
3) Perhaps you'll be hearing more of Wellisch when he sets up a Union and stops the UFC running roughshod across other people. As for Mohr...well he might need more then a debutees loss to get recognised. If The UFC arent prepared to let people recover from a single loss, then you'll never get to bloody see his face will you...and that wont be HIS fault.

Who has gotten cut from a single loss? It seems more to me that they are cut after 2/3 losses.. and really bad preformances...
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  #29  
Old 02-16-2009, 05:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyburn
That will eventually change if they keep up their most recent maltreatment.
What mis-treatment? The cuts? It's not like it's within their (UFCs) rights. I would be willing to bet it's in their contracts what could cause a contact to be voided..

Quote:
As for Unions...the reason noone wants one is because they are skeeeeerd that the Union might actually tell the UFC they cant do something. :
Well.. Maybe the UFC just says "F you Union.. " A union is not needed. If you think that a Union is the only think that would make changes.. welll.. your.. just.. UNAMERCIAN!!!

Quote:
I know one of the things about America I dislike is that across the board most things have been de-unionized. This makes working a littttttttle bit unprotected because who do you have to turn to for help if you are wronged?:
No unions and we are doing pretty good... hmmm interesting. Most larger companies and smaller.. protect their workers.. I guess it depends on what you view as "wronged".. We have many labor laws..


Quote:

I believe that Wal-Mart is now completely de-unionized
There has never been a wally world union in the states.. and besides.. the workers couldn't afford to pay for it.. and most are too stupid to get their lazy arses to work on TIME.. let alone for a union meeting..
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  #30  
Old 02-16-2009, 05:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rockdawg21
1) Why not complain to the source, Mr. White? When I was a teenager and if I had a problem with somebody, I confronted them. I didn't go to their mommy and daddy and ask them to handle the situation for me. A person could simply schedule an appointment to meet with him when he isn't busy. That's just a simple phone call and ask them guy for a few minutes of his time to express concerns, ask questions, etc.

2) If the UFC started bringing in a bunch of bums to head main events, nobody would buy them. It would be the demise of the UFC and the start of another organization. At least, that's how I feel.

3) It's like shopping at Wal-Mart, I don't agree with the way their workers are treated, but I still shop there because it saves me money. As long as the UFC keeps putting on fights that I enjoy watching, I'll keep buying PPV events and watching the shows on Spike. Like I said, fighters should speak up for themselves and go personally to Dana if they have any issues. I'm quite certain that Dana would respect them more if they brought the problems directly to him instead of going to the press or just complaining in radio shows and things like that. If they don't like the way the meeting was handled, they can go and fight elsewhere. Besides, Affliction is paying fighters much more than the UFC.

4) Sorry to hear what happened to you in your past. There are some companies who are quite large, like Wal-Mart, who I feel abuse their power. However, one thing I do know about Dana is he definitely would appreciate a guy who has the balls to confront him about issues and if they don't like the way Dana is handling it, they can leave.

Nicely said!

And besides.. it's a moot point. Prize fighters are mostly considered "contractors". I don't know what the english term would be.
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