Thank god we aren't baseball

Originally Posted by NateR

Baseball has been looking more and more disgraceful over the years and I come from a family whose lives practically revolved around the St. Louis Cardinals and the World Series. But it's just become so hard to follow the sport now without getting frustrated with the blatant corruption.

I don't think the sport needs to die, maybe it just needs a reboot. All-new management, all-new players. Just let it disappear for a couple of years and then rebuild it again from scratch.

I agree with Nate on this. Although I must admit my life used to revolve around another team which hasn't been to a World Series in a long time.

I think that baseball has other issues which are at least as serious as steroids.

The two superstations of the early years of cable (WTBS and WGN) used to carry most of the home games of the teams in their respective cities. This built up a huge fan base for both the Braves and the Cubs. WTBS does not carry Braves games anymore, and WGN doesn't have nearly as much baseball as it used to. These are just two examples of what I think is a more disturbing trend, baseball moving to sports networks that are available only as part of extra cost cable or satellite packages.

Of course this trend is explained by the money issue. But that's the problem for many people now, money.

I had to make a choice. Either I could continue to subscribe to the baseball package through Direct TV or I could spend the same amount monthly on an MMA PPV. So I gave up the baseball package.

I will still be able to watch some baseball, just not as much. Maybe I'll enjoy it more.

So what will happen to the fan base of baseball? I think it will start to erode. That's an even bigger problem for the future of baseball.

[J.B.]

I'm a White Sox fan, and WGN still plays MOST of the Cubs games, and even some White Sox games too. Heck, in Arizona, WGN is a part of the basic cable package just because of all the Chicago natives around Phoenix. When the games are not on WGN, they are on another basic cable channel called Comcast Sports Network if you are in the Chicago area. The only other games are on Sunday Night Baseball which is on ESPN. Anybody with BASIC cable gets ESPN.

MLB still has basic TV deals with local networks in all the major markets, so everybody is still getting to see their team play most of the time even if they don't have basic cable or satellite. The only people who really need the extra sports packages from their TV provider are people who don't live in the city of the team they are rooting for, or people who are crazy and want to watch every game. Although I will admit, I am more likely to listen to the games on the radio than actually watch them on TV. I'm just weird like that.

I don't think Baseball is at any risk of dying or even coming close. Even the steroids issue is really just a bump in the road, but it's definitely a big one.

[rockdawg21]

FYI, WGN is everywhere. It's part of Time Warner Cable, Mediacom Cable, DirecTV, Dish Network, etc. It's like getting the Braves games on TBS.

[Spiritwalker]

Originally Posted by JB Rattlesnake

No, I did not miss what you said, it was a lame attempt at sounding deep. Kinda like the entire point you are trying to make here. You make some decent points, but those points are latent with comments that are just silly and make no sense. Like this one...

It isn't the fault of the users.. it's a fault in the athlete. IMO

meaning The Users are not the problem. How many kids and amateur athletes started using because of the hype behind some of the biggest names in baseball.. the hype cause of the money that they make. The coddled and pampered, when others are working their asses off..The thugs (and yes there are some in MMA) that are million dollar criminals.. forget them... and I refuse to allow them to take $$ from me and mine.

The athletes are the ones that brings others into using.. the team mates that cover for the known users.. the teams that cover for the athletes..

Seriously, I bet without using the web you couldn't name 2 players on every team in the NFL, NBA, or MLB. Yet, you seem to have this insider knowledge on the ratio of people who are getting arrested in other leagues compared to MMA. Quit talking out of your ass, or at least stuff a breath mint up there so it's not so smelly.

Your right. I can't name 2 players on every team.. just many.. but I do know how many players are on a MLB, NBA and NFL team. Now you take that number.. and compare that to the number of MMA fighters in the UFC, WEC and Affiliation. Take that number and compare that to the number of steroid abusers, and violent criminals and arrests.. simple math.

As for a king's ransom, that's just hilarious. Why are stadiums still selling out all over the place? I can still get tickets to ANY major team in Chicago or Phoenix for far less than $100 a ticket. If you can't afford that, YOU are the one with the problem, not the teams.

They are not. Specifically in baseball. Basketball isn't doing to well either.. but instead of cleaning up the sports and getting respect from the fans.. they continue to pay WAYYY to much.. and to subsidize those paychecks.. they continue to raise ticket prices.. , but work to keep blackouts in place so fans can't watch at home.

Its funny how you fail to realize just how many spoiled brats and thugs are fighters too.

Baby Jay don't count.. the Diaz boys are thugs..I can't stand those fighters that have no "class".

Funny how no matter what negative point is made about MMA you would still sit there and say "it's better than team sports". Really man, everyone gets it, you don't like team sports. Nobody cares.

I love team sports.. I play baseball for the fun of it. I play touch football .. I am a coach and competitor in my dojo's competition team.. I think that the major league teams should start caring about their fans.. start putting effort to having players that are more for their team than just personal achievement. That's all.

So get out of the Sports section and just talk about MMA if you hate team sports so much.

Well considering that this thread was started in the UFC section, and I made statements that you take issue with.. I will finish what I start.

I never disagreed with you that other pro-sports have people with problems, but you fail to recognize the problems with MMA and just want to prop it up while trying to bash other sports.

The only problem with MMA is that is trying to get into areas where it is banned.. and not having as much success as I would like.. and many others...

Many MMA fighters need to be paid more.. but as far as steroids.. there are much bigger fish to fry.. and the UFC/WEC abide by the various commissions. The UFC/WEC/Affiliction/Ruckus in the Cage/Rumble on the Rock/ and various others.. do not mandate testing..

Quite simply, you are just a hater. I appreciate a nice lively discussion, and I am not afraid to admit when I am wrong about something, but you are just out to hate on other sports and talk down your nose rather than have an intelligent discussion. You blindly ignoring facts and using made up ratios is where it makes it impossible to debate with you.

simple math buddy.. simple math.. and I don't hate team sports.. I hate the corruption and the underhanded crap that is fed to fans.. the UFC has issues sure.. but again...much bigger fish..

PS - You can hate on the Cardinals all you like, because we all know that it's proving your point and not just making you look like punk.

I don't hate the Cards. I just prefer the St. Louis variety.. until the crap with Mark.. for baseball.. but in regards to football.. Kelly Stouffer was Da Bomb!

At least the Cardinals made it to the show. Too bad you couldnt afford tickets to the Panthers last home game in the playoffs, then you could have seen a real ass whooping. Next time AZ comes to town, let me know and I will buy you a couple tickets so Larry Fitzgerald can you show you how it's done.

You might not want to talk about what I can and can not afford.. I can afford a lot.. am I wealthy? Nah.. but I can afford a good deal.. but I do refuse to toss my money at thugs and drug users... like I said.. it's more fun to go see a high school game.. but it takes something away from the game when you have star high school players.. that can't read.. I would rather see the Charlotte Knights play baseball.. it's the same game.. and they are trying.. and you can "feel" the team atmosphere..

Yep.. the Panthers are great at knowing how to choke.. could care less about them either..

And remember the PSLs.. utter crap.. what about the fans ..

But Kevin Greene and Wes Walls.. man they were fun to watch.. Steve Beuerlein was an excellent QB

but look at them in the last few years.. hell even the cheerleaders get arrested...remember Rae Carruth...

[J.B.]

Spirit, the bottom line is you are not using "simple math". You are trying to make a very complex comparison and you are using made up facts to do it. Anybody could come up with your opinion if they just choose to ignore or write off the things fighters and the companies do that are less than desirable. Saying things like "they had mental issues", or "bigger fish to fry". Thats ridiculous. All the while, you forget the very basic fact that with more people comes more problems, hence the fact you see a higher number of people in other leagues with "problem children" so to speak. I don't think the ratio is really as far off as you are trying to suggest, and you don't have the facts to prove your point. You are being grossly unfair and biased in comparison when talking about the character of the athletes in other sports when compared to MMA. Period.

As for ticket prices and player compensation, I'm sorry you don't agree with people being fairly paid for what they bring to a company. As for people not going to games, you are just wrong on so many levels it's ridiculous. Did you forget about what our economy looks like? Considering how tight money is everywhere right now, these franchises are doing AWESOME. Sure, some of the smaller markets take a bigger hit, but that's how it always goes. It will bounce back. Some players ARE overpaid, but on the whole most players are not.

It isn't the fault of the users.. it's a fault in the athlete. IMO

meaning The Users are not the problem. How many kids and amateur athletes started using because of the hype behind some of the biggest names in baseball.. the hype cause of the money that they make. The coddled and pampered, when others are working their asses off..The thugs (and yes there are some in MMA) that are million dollar criminals.. forget them... and I refuse to allow them to take $$ from me and mine.

The athletes are the ones that brings others into using.. the team mates that cover for the known users.. the teams that cover for the athletes..

Bro, like I already said. I understood what you were saying, but you don't really make your points clear with vague statements like that one in bold. As for your point about kids juicing, thats all fine and dandy, because nobody is arguing that steroids should not be banned. But not ALL the biggest athletes are doing it, and not ALL the biggest athletes are wife beating, rapist, drug addict thugs. So WHY are you condemning all of pro team sports? Thats what I disagree with.

As for the Panthers, you mentioned it being expensive to go to a Panthers game with the family, so thats why I brought them up. You took a shot at the Cardinals first, so if you keep your punches above the belt, so will I.

[Spiritwalker]

Originally Posted by JB Rattlesnake

So WHY are you condemning all of pro team sports?

Because it's not about the team any more.. It's about the individuals on the teams.

MMA is more of a team sport than the NFL and MLB...

[J.B.]

Originally Posted by Spiritwalker

MMA is more of a team sport than the NFL and MLB...

No it's not.

Thats what I mean when I say you are making ridiculous statements.

Originally Posted by rockdawg21

FYI, WGN is everywhere. It's part of Time Warner Cable, Mediacom Cable, DirecTV, Dish Network, etc. It's like getting the Braves games on TBS.

Well yes of course it is. The difficulty is that the Chicago area sports teams have decided to form a Chicago Area Sports Network. The feed is provided by Comcast and is labeled Comcast Sports Chicago; or at least it is on Direct TV.

When Cubs games were available on Extra Innings last season much the time the feed was not provided by WGN but rather Comcast Sports Chicago. Odd thing is they did use the WGN announcers.

I have seen the broadcast schedule and there are still many games available on WGN but there has been a continuation of the shift away from WGN. Now that the Tribune no longer owns the Cubs, the trend will probably accelerate.

This means a reduction in the games available locally by broadcast and nationally as well unless you have an extra cost package.

For the Braves fans, the situation is even worse. WTBS will not carry any Braves games. Those will usually only be on Sports South.

[J.B.]

Originally Posted by cubsfan47

Well yes of course it is. The difficulty is that the Chicago area sports teams have decided to form a Chicago Area Sports Network. The feed is provided by Comcast and is labeled Comcast Sports Chicago; or at least it is on Direct TV.

When Cubs games were available on Extra Innings last season much the time the feed was not provided by WGN but rather Comcast Sports Chicago. Odd thing is they did use the WGN announcers.

I have seen the broadcast schedule and there are still many games available on WGN but there has been a continuation of the shift away from WGN. Now that the Tribune no longer owns the Cubs, the trend will probably accelerate.

This means a reduction in the games available locally by broadcast and nationally as well unless you have an extra cost package.

For the Braves fans, the situation is even worse. WTBS will not carry any Braves games. Those will usually only be on Sports South.

It's the same announcers because it's still the same production crew bringing you the game. Comcast Sports Network has a lot of the games for the Cubs, Sox, Bulls, and Blackhawks, but it's not an extra cost channel, it's part of basic cable (probably because Comcast is Chicago's cable provider). Also, they still air a LOT of the Cubs games on WGN and they also have White Sox games on another local channel that is not a cable network called WCIU Channel 26, but even when they air the games on that channel is still has the CSN logo attached.

As a Cubs fan you are lucky you can see ANY games without ordering an extra package. The Cubs get some extra perks being the lovable losers with one of the biggest fan-bases in professional sports. If I wanna watch games from my favorite teams in Arizona I either gotta order the expensive packages or find a good stream online. Needless to say, I prefer the latter.

[J.B.]

Great...now they are charging Tejada with lying to federal investigators...perfect time to waste more tax dollars. Don't get me wrong, I am against jucing, and I want the names of the other players exposed, but this is just stupid.

Why is congress spending hundreds of millions of dollars on prosecuting baseball players???