Health Reform

[Tyburn]

Originally Posted by NateR

I don't buy that. I've heard that the mortality rates and the quality of healthcare in countries like England and Canada are much, much worse than what we have here in the United States.

Coz we have a stupidly over populated Country, and you have a stupidly sparsely populated one

[Tyburn]

Originally Posted by Neezar

Exactly! And luckily nothing was wrong. If you have a condition that truly needs a MRI to diagnose then 14 months will literally determine whether you live or die.

Thats what I thought at the time. I beleieved I was gonna die Denise Noone believed that I was even unwell.

I think that if they had believed me, they might have sped the process up...but my comfort was...that if something went really wrong, there would come a point where I would be rushed to hospital...and then they would give me an MRI RIGHT AWAY...with a little bit of luck it wouldnt be too late

The Bad thing about the United States is that the Americans basically SELF-PERSCRIBE...and that is nigh on sinful. I've seen that you let your drugs company ADVERTIZE on TV. that is SO wrong.

So long as you wouldnt let a person with no insurance, die on the street, then I dont really think it matters about nationalizing your health care system...although it is considered a right to Europeans in the same way you have a right to bear Arms...we have the right to healthcare...your right its actually not free...its paid for in taxes. but to us the illusion passed is that it IS free...and it feels free

[Neezar]

Originally Posted by Tyburn

Thats what I thought at the time. I beleieved I was gonna die Denise Noone believed that I was even unwell.

I think that if they had believed me, they might have sped the process up...but my comfort was...that if something went really wrong, there would come a point where I would be rushed to hospital...and then they would give me an MRI RIGHT AWAY...with a little bit of luck it wouldnt be too late

The Bad thing about the United States is that the Americans basically SELF-PERSCRIBE...and that is nigh on sinful. I've seen that you let your drugs company ADVERTIZE on TV. that is SO wrong.

So long as you wouldnt let a person with no insurance, die on the street, then I dont really think it matters about nationalizing your health care system...although it is considered a right to Europeans in the same way you have a right to bear Arms...we have the right to healthcare...your right its actually not free...its paid for in taxes. but to us the illusion passed is that it IS free...and it feels free

Do you pay a percentage of your income or a set amount?

[Neezar]

Originally Posted by atomdanger

What about Canada?
They have a higher life expectancy and a better mortality rate than us.

I couldn't find this. Can you show me where you found this?

Originally Posted by NateR

I don't buy that. I've heard that the mortality rates and the quality of healthcare in countries like England and Canada are much, much worse than what we have here in the United States.


It's not going to work; but I guess some people are just going to have to find that out the hard way and pay with their lives or the lives of their loved ones.

You heard?
You heard from who?

(First number is US, the USA, the second is Canada)

U.S. Canada
Life Expectancy (Male) 74.8 77.4
Life Expectancy (Female) 80.1 82.4
Infant Mortality/1000 live births 6.8 5.3
Obesity Rate (Male) 31.1 17.0
Obesity Rate (Female) 32.2 19.0
HC spending as % of GDP (2005) 16.0% 10.4%

Originally Posted by Neezar

I couldn't find this. Can you show me where you found this?

http://healthcare-economist.com/2007...-canada-vs-us/
http://vorg.ca/2283-Healthcare-battle-Canada-vs-USA



I could go for days.

Originally Posted by Tyburn

The Bad thing about the United States is that the Americans basically SELF-PERSCRIBE...and that is nigh on sinful. I've seen that you let your drugs company ADVERTIZE on TV. that is SO wrong.

So long as you wouldnt let a person with no insurance, die on the street, then I dont really think it matters about nationalizing your health care system...although it is considered a right to Europeans in the same way you have a right to bear Arms...we have the right to healthcare...your right its actually not free...its paid for in taxes. but to us the illusion passed is that it IS free...and it feels free

They advertise everywhere, city buses, magazines, tv, etc...

They can also give Dr's gifts, and money. O_o
How can this be seen as a good idea?

Originally Posted by Neezar

Tell me a county that doesn't have a free clinic.

Free clinics only see a certain number of patient's per day because they are TOLD that is all they can see. EVERY medical facility will be that way under Nationalized health care. Didn't you read the article? They will be told 'You operate under this budget and you get not a penny more.' AND they are expected to cut budget every year because as they get better at what they do they should be more proficient therefore cutting costs every year. How many businesses do you know that cut their costs every year?

They are not TOLD thats how many they can see.
They are funded by DONATION and that is all they can afford to see.

The government doesn't fund a free clinic in every county, sorry.
In fact, I do not know of ANY government funded ones.

[NateR]

Originally Posted by atomdanger

You heard? lol
You heard from who? "they"?

That was a good laugh. (First number is US, the USA, the second is Canada)

U.S. Canada
Life Expectancy (Male) 74.8 77.4
Life Expectancy (Female) 80.1 82.4
Infant Mortality/1000 live births 6.8 5.3
Obesity Rate (Male) 31.1 17.0
Obesity Rate (Female) 32.2 19.0
HC spending as % of GDP (2005) 16.0% 10.4%

Y'know, I've heard that 78% of statistics are just made up on the spot.

What's your source for this? Who compiled the data? Did these numbers come from a group who supports socialized medicine? Are we sure that they didn't massage the numbers to support one agenda over another? Where did they get their data from? Did the hospitals and doctors report the data honestly and accurately? What was the sample size used to generate these percentages? How much time elapsed during these studies?

There are three types of lies: lies, damn lies and statistics. I see no reason to believe that those numbers represent the truth. You might be willing to just blindly accept any numbers thrown at you that reinforce your world view, but I prefer to be a little more discerning and intelligent about it.

Again, I'm speaking as someone who spent over 10 years under a form of free healthcare, in the US Army. From my experiences, it's not worth the price.

[NateR]

Originally Posted by atomdanger

http://healthcare-economist.com/2007...-canada-vs-us/
http://vorg.ca/2283-Healthcare-battle-Canada-vs-USA



I could go for days.

Oh yeah, the World Health Organization, now there's a reliable source of information.