Go Back   Matt-Hughes.com Official Forums > General Discussions > Politics

View Poll Results: Should the Lone Star state secede from the U.S.?
Texas should secede from the U.S. 9 37.50%
Texas should not secede from the U.S. 13 54.17%
Don't know... 2 8.33%
Voters: 24. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #121  
Old 05-02-2009, 01:58 PM
Vizion's Avatar
Vizion Vizion is offline
Hughes fanboy
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 2,214
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by atomdanger
Exactly...

I prove it won't cost more, and disprove many other MYTHS,
and its time to say no response
Haha - no response...ha! Start another thread on thsi subject and let's go, but Monday, not today, I have a life to live this weekend, getting into a typingfrenzy will steal away my freetime. Your article so far has me illconvinced

you on???
Reply With Quote
  #122  
Old 05-02-2009, 03:55 PM
rockdawg21's Avatar
rockdawg21 rockdawg21 is offline
I'm kind of a big deal
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: San Antonio, TX
Posts: 5,584
Default

Back to the subject at hand. I voted yes. We should reinstitute the United States of America and leave the Ununited States of Obama.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #123  
Old 05-02-2009, 07:49 PM
J.B.'s Avatar
J.B. J.B. is offline
WAR CARDINALS!
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Apache Juntion, AZ
Posts: 8,462
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizion
Nice try...I may not be born and raised here, but I think I'm pretty astute with American politics. So, we ARE united huh? This, deeply divided country IS united you claim. And, BO will do damage severe enough to cripple us I bet too...just wait and see....like I said JB I hope you're right.
Yes Vizion, our country is still united, even in these tough times. I was not even alluding to the fact that you are from the UK, if you really think that this President is the "end of America" then you are not as astute with American politics as you may think.

I'm sorry to say it, but it's that over the top mentality that is going to drive the average people away from conservatives and republicans around election time. You say, "who cares eh?", but that proves you only care about yourself and your view of how this nation should be. Rather than worrying about running away from the problems and starting a "new country" in Texas, which ain't gonna happen anyway, why not worry about fixing the country we already have? Spread the word, and encourage people to vote.

I spent all of last year preaching why we should NOT elect Obama, but the will of the media and the people had it's way. Bush was a VERY unpopular president, and he made it hard to get a conservative elected last time around. As long as conservatives stay focused on important matters and keep calling Obama and Congress to task on his decisions, we will see another shift in power in 4 years, be it in the Congress or the Presidency, or both.

Last edited by J.B.; 05-03-2009 at 09:02 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #124  
Old 05-03-2009, 05:15 PM
Jonlion's Avatar
Jonlion Jonlion is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: London
Posts: 1,306
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JB Rattlesnake
Yes Vizion, our country is still united, even in these tough times. I was not even alluding to the fact that you are from the UK, if you really think that this President is the "end of America" then you are not as astute with American politics as you may think.

I'm sorry to say it, but it's that over the top mentality that is going to drive the average people away from conservatives and republicans around election time. You say, "who cares eh?", but that proves you only care about yourself and your view of how this nation should be. Rather than worrying about running away from the problems and starting a "new country" in Texas, which ain't gonna happen anyway, why not worry about fixing the country we already have? Spread the word, and encourage people to vote.

I spent all of last year preaching why we should NOT elect Obama, but the will of the media and the people had it's way. Bush was a VERY unpopular president, and he made it hard to get a conservative elected last time around. As long as conservatives stay focused on important matters and keep calling Obama and Congress to task on his decisions, we will see another shift in power in 4 years, be it in the Congress or the Presidency, or both.


Again a post I agree with. Well said!

To run from the problems is a cop out.

Even Liberals had more balls than you Vizion, least they hung about to oust the President for one they wanted!

ha ha
Reply With Quote
  #125  
Old 05-03-2009, 05:20 PM
Tyburn's Avatar
Tyburn Tyburn is offline
Angry @ Injustice!
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: England
Posts: 16,910
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JB Rattlesnake
we will see another shift in power in 4 years, be it in the Congress or the Presidency, or both.
It'll probably be both

Obama is already doing...well...nothing where he should be doing something, and something where he should be doing nothing...and not much else

He's black...so get over it already...the novelty is fast wearing off...finally, he's being seen as simply another human being...shortly, he'll be seen as simply another politician...after that, not even the Liberals will want him
Reply With Quote
  #126  
Old 05-03-2009, 07:58 PM
J.B.'s Avatar
J.B. J.B. is offline
WAR CARDINALS!
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Apache Juntion, AZ
Posts: 8,462
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyburn
He's black...so get over it already...
I do hope you are speaking to the general uneducated goon, and not myself, when you said this.

Other than that, I agree with everything you said.
Reply With Quote
  #127  
Old 05-03-2009, 09:27 PM
Tyburn's Avatar
Tyburn Tyburn is offline
Angry @ Injustice!
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: England
Posts: 16,910
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JB Rattlesnake
I do hope you are speaking to the general uneducated goon, and not myself, when you said this.

Other than that, I agree with everything you said.
Yes...I was speaking Generically....I knew you didnt care what colour he was...but I think some people are guilty of positive racism, and might only have ellected him because of his colour....I think they are now seeing that colour has nothing to do with political prowess
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #128  
Old 05-03-2009, 09:38 PM
J.B.'s Avatar
J.B. J.B. is offline
WAR CARDINALS!
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Apache Juntion, AZ
Posts: 8,462
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyburn
Yes...I was speaking Generically....I knew you didnt care what colour he was...but I think some people are guilty of positive racism, and might only have ellected him because of his colour....I think they are now seeing that colour has nothing to do with political prowess
I agree completely, and the mystique is definitely starting to wear off.
Reply With Quote
  #129  
Old 05-04-2009, 12:23 AM
Neezar's Avatar
Neezar Neezar is offline
SupaDupaMod
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: South
Posts: 6,478
Send a message via Yahoo to Neezar
Default

Atom, where did you get this crap? This is a lot of different stats that relate to different areas all twisted to fit this agenda. Most of these statements are so broad ranged that they could never be proven nor disproven. And some of these statements contradict each other while others don't even make a direct point. Great tactics though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by atomdanger
1. Why doesnít the United States have universal health care as a right of citizenship? The United States is the only industrialized nation that does not guarantee access to health care as a right of citizenship. 28 industrialized nations have single payer universal health care systems, while 1 (Germany) has a multipayer universal health care system like President Clinton proposed for the United States.

2. Myth One: The United States has the best health care system in the world.

* Fact One: The United States ranks 23rd in infant mortality, down from 12th in 1960 and 21st in 1990

* Fact Two: The United States ranks 20th in life expectancy for women down from 1st in 1945 and 13th in 1960

* Fact Three: The United States ranks 21st in life expectancy for men down from 1st in 1945 and 17th in 1960.

* Fact Four: The United States ranks between 50th and 100th in immunizations depending on the immunization. Overall US is 67th, right behind Botswana

* Fact Five: Outcome studies on a variety of diseases, such as coronary artery disease, and renal failure show the United States to rank below Canada and a wide variety of industrialized nations.

* Conclusion: The United States ranks poorly relative to other industrialized nations in health care despite having the best trained health care providers and the best medical infrastructure of any industrialized nation

3. Myth Two: Universal Health Care Would Be Too Expensive

* Fact One: The United States spends at least 40% more per capita on health care than any other industrialized country with universal health care

* Fact Two: Federal studies by the Congressional Budget Office and the General Accounting office show that single payer universal health care would save 100 to 200 Billion dollars per year despite covering all the uninsured and increasing health care benefits.

* Fact Three: State studies by Massachusetts and Connecticut have shown that single payer universal health care would save 1 to 2 Billion dollars per year from the total medical expenses in those states despite covering all the uninsured and increasing health care benefits

* Fact Four: The costs of health care in Canada as a % of GNP, which were identical to the United States when Canada changed to a single payer, universal health care system in 1971, have increased at a rate much lower than the United States, despite the US economy being much stronger than Canadaís.

* Conclusion: Single payer universal health care costs would be lower than the current US system due to lower administrative costs. The United States spends 50 to 100% more on administration than single payer systems. By lowering these administrative costs the United States would have the ability to provide universal health care, without managed care, increase benefits and still save money

4. Myth Three: Universal Health Care Would Deprive Citizens of Needed Services

* Fact One: Studies reveal that citizens in universal health care systems have more doctor visits and more hospital days than in the US

* Fact Two: Around 30% of Americans have problem accessing health care due to payment problems or access to care, far more than any other industrialized country. About 17% of our population is without health insurance. About 75% of ill uninsured people have trouble accessing/paying for health care.

* Fact Three: Comparisons of Difficulties Accessing Care Are Shown To Be Greater In The US Than Canada (see graph)

* Fact Four: Access to health care is directly related to income and race in the United States. As a result the poor and minorities have poorer health than the wealthy and the whites.

* Fact Five: There would be no lines under a universal health care system in the United States because we have about a 30% oversupply of medical equipment and surgeons, whereas demand would increase about 15%

* Conclusion: The US denies access to health care based on the ability to pay. Under a universal health care system all would access care. There would be no lines as in other industrialized countries due to the oversupply in our providers and infrastructure, and the willingness/ability of the United States to spend more on health care than other industrialized nations.

5. Myth Four: Universal Health Care Would Result In Government Control And Intrusion Into Health Care Resulting In Loss Of Freedom Of Choice

* Fact One: There would be free choice of health care providers under a single payer universal health care system, unlike our current managed care system in which people are forced to see providers on the insurerís panel to obtain medical benefits

* Fact Two: There would be no management of care under a single payer, universal health care system unlike the current managed care system which mandates insurer preapproval for services thus undercutting patient confidentiality and taking health care decisions away from the health care provider and consumer

* Fact Three: Although health care providers fees would be set as they are currently in 90% of cases, providers would have a means of negotiating fees unlike the current managed care system in which they are set in corporate board rooms with profits, not patient care, in mind

* Fact Four: Taxes, fees and benefits would be decided by the insurer which would be under the control of a diverse board representing consumers, providers, business and government. It would not be a government controlled system, although the government would have to approve the taxes. The system would be run by a public trust, not the government.

* Conclusion: Single payer, universal health care administered by a state public health system would be much more democratic and much less intrusive than our current system. Consumers and providers would have a voice in determining benefits, rates and taxes. Problems with free choice, confidentiality and medical decision making would be resolved

6. Myth Five: Universal Health Care Is Socialized Medicine And Would Be Unacceptable To The Public

* Fact One: Single payer universal health care is not socialized medicine. It is health care payment system, not a health care delivery system. Health care providers would be in fee for service practice, and would not be employees of the government, which would be socialized medicine. Single payer health care is not socialized medicine, any more than the public funding of education is socialized education, or the public funding of the defense industry is socialized defense.

* Fact Two: Repeated national and state polls have shown that between 60 and 75% of Americans would like a universal health care system (see The Harris Poll #78, October 20, 2005)

* Conclusion: Single payer, universal health care is not socialized medicine and would be preferred by the majority of the citizens of this country

7. Myth Six: The Problems With The US Health Care System Are Being Solved and Are Best Solved By Private Corporate Managed Care Medicine because they are the most efficient

* Fact One: Private for profit corporation are the lease efficient deliverer of health care. They spend between 20 and 30% of premiums on administration and profits. The public sector is the most efficient. Medicare spends 3% on administration.

* Fact Two: The same procedure in the same hospital the year after conversion from not-for profit to for-profit costs in between 20 to 35% more

* Fact Three: Health care costs in the United States grew more in the United States under managed care in 1990 to 1996 than any other industrialized nation with single payer universal health care

* Fact Four: The quality of health care in the US has deteriorated under managed care. Access problems have increased. The number of uninsured has dramatically increased (increase of 10 million to 43.4 million from 1989 to 1996, increase of 2.4% from 1989 to 1996- 16% in 1996 and increasing each year).

* Fact Five: The level of satisfaction with the US health care system is the lowest of any industrialized nation.

* Fact Six: 80% of citizens and 71% of doctors believe that managed care has caused quality of care to be compromised

* Conclusion: For profit, managed care can not solve the US health care problems because health care is not a commodity that people shop for, and quality of care must always be compromised when the motivating factor for corporations is to save money through denial of care and decreasing provider costs. In addition managed care has introduced problems of patient confidentiality and disrupted the continuity of care through having limited provider networks.
Reply With Quote
  #130  
Old 05-04-2009, 12:30 AM
Neezar's Avatar
Neezar Neezar is offline
SupaDupaMod
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: South
Posts: 6,478
Send a message via Yahoo to Neezar
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizion
Haha - no response...ha! Start another thread on thsi subject and let's go, but Monday, not today, I have a life to live this weekend, getting into a typingfrenzy will steal away my freetime. Your article so far has me illconvinced

you on???
I'm in! I can disprove most of that crap he posted or at the very least show how stupid some of sounds when you try to apply it to reality.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 01:31 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.