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  #61  
Old 01-30-2009, 08:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Tyburn
I know Christians who have committed suicide.

One of my Fathers friends from the York revival, he was a minister, but when his Wife decided to leave him for someone else and took the Children with her, he lay down on the rail tracks and waited for the train
Well, that man might have been a Christian, but there's a good chance that he wasn't born again.
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  #62  
Old 01-30-2009, 08:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Crisco
I wonder what God does when someone commits that sin( out of ignorance perhaps) but later repents and finds salvation..
Well, that's the problem with the unpardonable sin, once you've committed it and convinced yourself that the Holy Spirit is something evil, then that's it. You have no chance of repenting or being saved after that. Again, not because GOD is unwilling to forgive, but because you no longer believe that you require forgiveness.

Salvation is not something that we have to do for ourselves. We don't have to go seeking GOD, He comes looking for us. GOD does all the work in salvation and all we have to do is stop struggling and fighting against Him and accept it.

I've heard it described it as Jesus coming to the front door of your house and knocking. The first time He comes to the door, He knocks loudly and confidently calls out your name from outside; but there is no answer, so He leaves. He comes back later and knocks again, still loudly, but a little more subdued. Again, no answer so He leaves. He returns a third time and knocks a little softer and doesn't say anything, still no answer, so he leaves again. When He returns a fourth, fifth and sixth time, the knocking on the door gets softer and softer and He doesn't wait around as long before leaving. Eventually, He just stops coming to your door and that's it, you've just wasted every chance you've had for salvation. With your unresponsiveness, you've told GOD that you don't want to have anything to do with Him, so He gives you exactly what you want: an eternity without Him. You've just committed the unpardonable sin.
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  #63  
Old 01-30-2009, 08:52 PM
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Gezz, I'm glad I only took two knocks



Quote:
Originally Posted by NateR
Well, that's the problem with the unpardonable sin, once you've committed it and convinced yourself that the Holy Spirit is something evil, then that's it. You have no chance of repenting or being saved after that. Again, not because GOD is unwilling to forgive, but because you no longer believe that you require forgiveness.

Salvation is not something that we have to do for ourselves. We don't have to go seeking GOD, He comes looking for us. GOD does all the work in salvation and all we have to do is stop struggling and fighting against Him and accept it.

I've heard it described it as Jesus coming to the front door of your house and knocking. The first time He comes to the door, He knocks loudly and confidently calls out your name from outside; but there is no answer, so He leaves. He comes back later and knocks again, still loudly, but a little more subdued. Again, no answer so He leaves. He returns a third time and knocks a little softer and doesn't say anything, still no answer, so he leaves again. When He returns a fourth, fifth and sixth time, the knocking on the door gets softer and softer and He doesn't wait around as long before leaving. Eventually, He just stops coming to your door and that's it, you've just wasted every chance you've had for salvation. With your unresponsiveness, you've told GOD that you don't want to have anything to do with Him, so He gives you exactly what you want: an eternity without Him. You've just committed the unpardonable sin.
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  #64  
Old 01-30-2009, 09:13 PM
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I'm not sure which knock I answered on but it was the best day of my life...

It's going on about 2 years now that I've been saved.
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  #65  
Old 01-30-2009, 09:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NateR
Well, that's the problem with the unpardonable sin, once you've committed it and convinced yourself that the Holy Spirit is something evil, then that's it. You have no chance of repenting or being saved after that. Again, not because GOD is unwilling to forgive, but because you no longer believe that you require forgiveness.

Salvation is not something that we have to do for ourselves. We don't have to go seeking GOD, He comes looking for us. GOD does all the work in salvation and all we have to do is stop struggling and fighting against Him and accept it.

I've heard it described it as Jesus coming to the front door of your house and knocking. The first time He comes to the door, He knocks loudly and confidently calls out your name from outside; but there is no answer, so He leaves. He comes back later and knocks again, still loudly, but a little more subdued. Again, no answer so He leaves. He returns a third time and knocks a little softer and doesn't say anything, still no answer, so he leaves again. When He returns a fourth, fifth and sixth time, the knocking on the door gets softer and softer and He doesn't wait around as long before leaving. Eventually, He just stops coming to your door and that's it, you've just wasted every chance you've had for salvation. With your unresponsiveness, you've told GOD that you don't want to have anything to do with Him, so He gives you exactly what you want: an eternity without Him. You've just committed the unpardonable sin.
Then explain "Seek and ye shall find, knock and the door shall be opened unto you"

See...what youve said is just as unscriptural as suggesting Suicide is the unpardonable sin, because there is nothing in the Bible that says Jesus goes to you, and then he gives up on bothering to knock on your door. His love is unconditional, and the Old Testament clearly shows that he has never-ending patience...he bails Israel out every single time...sooo I dont think that your description is very accurate.

You are supposed to search! You should be encouraged to search with everything you have. GOD sanctifies and reedeems, but the unsaved shouldnt just sit on their arse and do nothing!
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  #66  
Old 01-30-2009, 09:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyburn
Then explain "Seek and ye shall find, knock and the door shall be opened unto you"

See...what youve said is just as unscriptural as suggesting Suicide is the unpardonable sin, because there is nothing in the Bible that says Jesus goes to you, and then he gives up on bothering to knock on your door. His love is unconditional, and the Old Testament clearly shows that he has never-ending patience...he bails Israel out every single time...sooo I dont think that your description is very accurate.

You are supposed to search! You should be encouraged to search with everything you have. GOD sanctifies and reedeems, but the unsaved shouldnt just sit on their arse and do nothing!
You've missed the point entirely. You're taking the illustration too literally and it's not mine, I heard it during a sermon when I was a kid and it's always stuck with me. Any parable, illustration, word picture (whatever you want to call them) can be overanalyzed and torn apart if you want to; but that's not the point of them.

GOD never turns away anyone who seeks Him, however, we don't need to seek Him to be saved, because that would imply a works-based salvation.

The illustration of Jesus knocking on the door is just meant to represent someone who ignores GOD completely through their life. It's not meant to represent every single human being on the planet, it's meant to give an overall idea that GOD is the one who is coming to us, not the other way around. As CS Lewis put it: (and I'm paraphrasing here) Religion is man seeking GOD, Christianity is GOD seeking man.

Another "word picture" is of a lamb who's fallen off of a small cliff and is entangled in some thorn bushes. The shepherd finds the lamb and has to reach down to grab the lamb and pull him back up. However, the lamb is in pain and frightened and keeps fighting the shepherd so that he can't get a good enough grip to pull the lamb loose and lift him to safety. So the shepherd has to wait until the lamb has completely exhausted himself from struggling and has no more strength to resist the shepherd reaching down, grabbing hold of the lamb and pulling it to safety.

Obviously the shepherd refers to GOD and the lamb is us. GOD has done all the work necessary for us to be saved, all we have to do is stop resisting Him and allow Him to reach down and grab hold of us. Once we do that, he will never let us go.

The thing about these word pictures is, if they aren't working for you, then ignore them. They're not biblical, they're just meant to help illustrate a point.
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  #67  
Old 01-30-2009, 09:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NateR
You've missed the point entirely. You're taking the illustration too literally and it's not mine, I heard it during a sermon when I was a kid and it's always stuck with me. Any parable, illustration, word picture (whatever you want to call them) can be overanalyzed and torn apart if you want to; but that's not the point of them.

GOD never turns away anyone who seeks Him, however, we don't need to seek Him to be saved, because that would imply a works-based salvation.

The illustration of Jesus knocking on the door is just meant to represent someone who ignores GOD completely through their life. It's not meant to represent every single human being on the planet, it's meant to give an overall idea that GOD is the one who is coming to us, not the other way around. As CS Lewis put it: (and I'm paraphrasing here) Religion is man seeking GOD, Christianity is GOD seeking man.

Another "word picture" is of a lamb who's fallen off of a small cliff and is entangled in some thorn bushes. The shepherd finds the lamb and has to reach down to grab the lamb and pull him back up. However, the lamb is in pain and frightened and keeps fighting the shepherd so that he can't get a good enough grip to pull the lamb loose and lift him to safety. So the shepherd has to wait until the lamb has completely exhausted himself from struggling and has no more strength to resist the shepherd reaching down, grabbing hold of the lamb and pulling it to safety.

Obviously the shepherd refers to GOD and the lamb is us. GOD has done all the work necessary for us to be saved, all we have to do is stop resisting Him and allow Him to reach down and grab hold of us. Once we do that, he will never let us go.

The thing about these word pictures is, if they aren't working for you, then ignore them. They're not biblical, they're just meant to help illustrate a point.
Are you talking about this


[URL=http://g.imageshack.us/img149/huntlightofworldap7.jpg/1/][IMG]

Its a Painting of Christ knocking at a door. The door is supposed to represent the unsaved heart, and you'll notice there is no handle, it can only be opened from the inside. Its called "The Light of The World"

"Behold I stand at the door and knock...." There are several of these paintings...one lies as the Rearadross for the Middlesex Regimental Chapel in Saint Paul's Cathedrals' North Transept.
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  #68  
Old 01-30-2009, 09:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyburn
Are you talking about this


[URL=http://g.imageshack.us/img149/huntlightofworldap7.jpg/1/][IMG]

Its a Painting of Christ knocking at a door. The door is supposed to represent the unsaved heart, and you'll notice there is no handle, it can only be opened from the inside. Its called "The Light of The World"

"Behold I stand at the door and knock...." There are several of these paintings...one lies as the Rearadross for the Middlesex Regimental Chapel in Saint Paul's Cathedrals' North Transept.
Yep, that's the idea. I think when I first heard it, the door was referred to as the "heart's door."
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  #69  
Old 01-30-2009, 10:04 PM
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Yep, that's the idea. I think when I first heard it, the door was referred to as the "heart's door."
I understand you now...sorry I was reading you a completely different way. Yeah....Do you remember when we were in London for UFC85? Well one of the Three Evensongs I went to was a commemoration of the Annerversary of the donation of this painting to the Cathedral, The Painters Great Grand-daughter sat next to me

The Rearadross must be something like Twelve Feet High behind the Altar, its very large and had two large doors so that it could be hidden on the Saturday between Good Friday and Easter Sunday
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  #70  
Old 01-31-2009, 08:04 AM
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QFT

so what happened to all authority is given by God. john 19:11

shouldnt we be praying for Obama; rather than criticise and point fingers saying he is not qualified.

give the man a chance, if he truely is born again as he claims by the resurecction of Christ, providing he seeks God while in office who could be more qualified???

Moses??? Joshua????Paul???
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