Iowa Supreme Court legalizes gay marriage

Originally Posted by Chris F

Why? Because Marriage is a religious institution and it should remain one man and one woman. I personally do not think non Christians should be allowed to marry. If they want the tax rights they should enter into domestic partnerships. Gays have every constitutional right straights do. marriage is not a right and these Judges should be disbarred and sent back to law school.

Marriage in a court is not a religious institution .. that is why i am okay with gay marriages ..... they can't force religions to marry gay couples, but if someone wants to get "married" in a court, in front of a JP, well there is no mention of God ... As for marriage being a Christian ceremony, you are wrong, there were plenty of people getting married and religions older than Christianity that have marriage as a ceremony, so don't know what you are talking about

[NateR]

Originally Posted by Buzzard

Do you think that homosexuals are born that way or choose it as a lifestyle?

If you think that they are born that way and believe in god, yet oppose it, then aren't you opposing something that god created?

Born homosexual? That's yet to be proven. Born sinful? Definitely. So the point is moot. The Bible tells us that ALL people are born sinful and corrupted and that we can NEVER make ourselves worthy of GOD's salvation. That's why Jesus needed to come to Earth, born of a virgin, to break the curse of sin and give humankind a chance for salvation.

[NateR]

Originally Posted by rearnakedchoke

Marriage in a court is not a religious institution .. that is why i am okay with gay marriages ..... they can't force religions to marry gay couples, but if someone wants to get "married" in a court, in front of a JP, well there is no mention of God ... As for marriage being a Christian ceremony, you are wrong, there were plenty of people getting married and religions older than Christianity that have marriage as a ceremony, so don't know what you are talking about

Actually marriage was created by GOD, as documented in Genesis chapter 2. So it existed alongside the first two humans. While it does predate the founding of Christianity, the basic point that Chris F is trying to make is that the institution was created by the same GOD who is worshiped by the Christians and Jews. So, in that sense, any marriages performed that don't honor the only true GOD are illegitimate in the eyes of GOD.

I'm not sure if I agree with that completely, since the Bible seems to hold pagan marriages as equally binding compared to Jewish marriages (there are no accounts of Christian marriages in the Bible, that I am aware of). If there is a verse that someone knows about that suggests otherwise, then I'd be interested to read it.

Originally Posted by Vizion

Ugh. I bet if you polled every Iowan it would be in the 80% range that would oppose this.

Thanks goodness for judges who legislate from the bench, yay democracy!!!

works well don't it?

Well, i am sure when they ended segregation and slavery, most people were opposed to it also ... so don't get your point ...

Originally Posted by NateR

Actually marriage was created by GOD, as documented in Genesis chapter 2. So it existed alongside the first two humans. While it does predate the founding of Christianity, the basic point that Chris F is trying to make is that the institution was created by the same GOD who is worshiped by the Christians and Jews. So, in that sense, any marriages performed that don't honor the only true GOD are illegitimate in the eyes of GOD.

I'm not sure if I agree with that completely, since the Bible seems to hold pagan marriages as equally binding compared to Jewish marriages (there are no accounts of Christian marriages in the Bible, that I am aware of). If there is a verse that someone knows about that suggests otherwise, then I'd be interested to read it.

right, but Chris said non-Christians, so that would include Jews ...

[NateR]

Originally Posted by rearnakedchoke

Well, i am sure when they ended segregation and slavery, most people were opposed to it also ... so don't get your point ...

Untrue, the Civil Rights movement was actually extremely popular at the time and was only heavily resisted in the southern states. Primarily by southern Democrats.

Plus, Civil Rights (like the Abolitionist Movement) was a largely Christian movement (Martin Luther King Jr. was a Reverend after all) and was supported by many churches in the north.

Finally, nobody can contest that blacks are a race that people are born into. Two black parents will produce black children, that's the way race works. However, we've had no accounts of two gay parents naturally producing gay offspring. Simply because gay parents can't naturally reproduce.

So, trying to compare Gay Rights to the Civil Rights movement is really just a distortion of the facts. A black person can't choose to not be black (Michael Jackson doesn't count), however homosexuals can be successfully rescued from that lifestyle. There are plenty of Christian organizations that do just that and are very successful at it.

[NateR]

Originally Posted by rearnakedchoke

right, but Chris said non-Christians, so that would include Jews ...

Well, if that's what he meant, then I would disagree with him on that point. However, the rest of my argument stands.

Folk's are no more born or excused Homosexual than they are Drunkards or Drug addicts!

Originally Posted by Tyburn

Really...

I'd like you to tell me about some of them please

Not much to really tell, but here goes. There were flowers, guests and an official who married them. They both recited their vows, agreed to stay true to each other and were pronounced husband and wife.

Another one was very similar, except for the amount of guests. Both of these couples are still married the last time I heard.

I went to a Buddhist or Hindu wedding when I was younger, and I really don't remember any of it to tell the truth. It was the last place I wanted to be. I would rather have been out playing or skating or doing anything else besides being at a wedding. I was told that since I was invited, it would be polite for me to attend.

Bear in mind your talking to someone who was active in the homosexual lifestyle

Are you ready for my answer

If you feel comfortable in sharing, don't let me stop you.

[NateR]

Originally Posted by KENTUCKYREDBONE

Folk's are no more born or excused Homosexual than they are Drunkards or Drug addicts!

I would agree with that. Until 1973, Homosexuality was listed as a mental illness. It was removed from the medical textbooks for purely political and idealistic reasons. There is no scientific evidence, that I'm aware of, that states homosexuality is anything but a mental disorder.

Even if it is a mental disorder that they are born with, then I would liken it to schizophrenia. An illness that can be treated, but also one that you are going to have for the rest of your life. However, no one would ever try to claim that there is nothing wrong with a schizophrenic and that they are brave for accepting their schizophrenia and that doctors are bigots for trying to treat them. That just wouldn't be logical.