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  #51  
Old 07-19-2013, 02:03 PM
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County Mike County Mike is offline
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Zimmerman didn't CHASE Trayvon. He merely followed to watch where he went. At one point, he lost track of Trayvon, had no idea where he was. Trayvon could have easily just gone home at that point. He was no longer being followed. Instead, he chose to go back and confront Zimmerman. That's why it was self defense for Zimmerman. He did not start the fight.
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  #52  
Old 07-20-2013, 03:33 AM
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A woman said she saw two men running 10 feet apart. Then later changed her testimony to maybe it was just one man running. The 10 feet apart is a pretty good detail. lol. I don't know why she changed her story.

I'm sure that Martin was beating Zimmerman up. And technically by law he was covered in shooting the kid under self defense.

However, I still believe Zimmerman was the aggressor and Martin was fighting out of self defense to begin with.
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  #53  
Old 07-20-2013, 05:07 PM
Bonnie Bonnie is offline
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Originally Posted by Neezar View Post
A woman said she saw two men running 10 feet apart. Then later changed her testimony to maybe it was just one man running. The 10 feet apart is a pretty good detail. lol. I don't know why she changed her story.

I'm sure that Martin was beating Zimmerman up. And technically by law he was covered in shooting the kid under self defense.

However, I still believe Zimmerman was the aggressor and Martin was fighting out of self defense to begin with.
How are you defining "aggressor"? A lot of people are saying he was the aggressor because he got out of his car, I don't agree with that. Neither of them had broken any laws or done anything illegal until the first punch was thrown, and Zimmerman is the one with the broken nose. The only mark on Trayvon is the bullet wound. Zimmerman could have used his gun a lot sooner than he did, but he didn't do that. If he was the aggressor I would have expected the shot to come sooner.

Two things you haven't commented on, 1) both Mike and I hit on the fact both of them tell the people they are on the phone with that they've lost sight of the other one, and 2) those 4 minutes Trayvon had to get safely home. They've lost sight of each other and Trayvon has the time to get safely home. Why didn't he go home! How do you get around that?!
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  #54  
Old 07-21-2013, 03:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Bonnie View Post
How are you defining "aggressor"? A lot of people are saying he was the aggressor because he got out of his car, I don't agree with that. Neither of them had broken any laws or done anything illegal until the first punch was thrown, and Zimmerman is the one with the broken nose. The only mark on Trayvon is the bullet wound. Zimmerman could have used his gun a lot sooner than he did, but he didn't do that. If he was the aggressor I would have expected the shot to come sooner.

He didn't just get of his car. He gave chase. He admits that on the 911 call. Dispatch tells him not to so he stops. However, he had given exact address to clubhouse. Tells them to go left of clubhouse past mailboxes and there is his truck. (Pretty exact directions, why look for street name?) Dispatch suggests meeting police at the mailboxes. He at first agrees and then tells her to have them call him and he will let them know where he is. (He has no intention of giving up the pursuit, imo.) He has already expressed outrage that they always get away. And upset that he 'lost him' on the phone. I call him the aggressor because I believe he continued to pursue Martin. (and probably tried to detain him)

Two things you haven't commented on, 1) both Mike and I hit on the fact both of them tell the people they are on the phone with that they've lost sight of the other one, and 2) those 4 minutes Trayvon had to get safely home. They've lost sight of each other and Trayvon has the time to get safely home. Why didn't he go home! How do you get around that?!
He told his girlfriend that he was going to try to lose the guy following him. I'm not sure I would want to lead someone following me to my front door.

Yeah, and about those 4 mins. What was Zimmerman doing? Did it take him 4 mins to look for a street sign and start back to his car? He has given them exact directions to his truck. Why not just meet them there?

Martin's girlfriend was on the phone with him until 1 min before 911 calls about a fight. She says he was at his father's place, heard the initial confrontation of them meeting up last time. I believe Zimmerman found him there, Martin ran (hence the woman who saw the running of two people 10 feet apart "then later maybe only one, lol" guy ), Zimmerman caught him and then proceeded to get his ass beat.

I believe he shot Martin in self defense but I think he got himself in that position to start with.

Neighborhood watch people are not supposed to follow/pursue. It's in the handbook. lol

I believe this was vigilante justice. However in this case the kid was doing nothing wrong.
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Old 07-21-2013, 04:17 PM
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btw, in an interview the police chief (the one on Zimmerman's side that lost his job) stated that Zimmerman had "lost" Martin and was on his way back to his car when he was attacked.

Really? Nothing about looking for a street sign there. And again, what about the time lapse. What was Zimmerman doing?
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  #56  
Old 07-21-2013, 10:59 PM
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Unfortunately we don't have video with audio so we can all see and hear exactly what took place. Even if we did have it, people would still spin it to suit there own purpose/agenda.
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  #57  
Old 07-21-2013, 11:19 PM
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Romany Malco Pens ‘Message to Trayvon Sympathizers’



From EurWeb.com:
Quote:
Romany Malco, who reprises his role as Zeke in the recently wrapped “Think Like a Man, Too,” weighed into the Trayvon Martin topic from a different angle. In a blog on The Huffington Post, the actor pointed out the role of mainstream news, pop culture and economics in this story steamrolling over more prevalent black on black shooting crimes that are largely uncovered by the press.

He wrote:
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I haven’t touched on the Trayvon Martin issue because race matters in this country are the paralysis of the American people. To constructively discuss Trayvon would require empathy, introspection and an understanding of America’s social and economic history. This is why the open forums we have seen thus far seem to fuel more ignorance and bias than reasonable debate.

To be brutally honest, the only reason people are even aware of Trayvon Martin is because it became a topic within mainstream news and pop culture. Meaning: News directors saw it as a profitable, sensational story. Hundreds of blacks die annually in South Side Chicago without even a blurb. Trayvon isn’t in the mainstream news for any reason other than ratings and profit. The news coverage on the Zimmerman case almost implies that the killing of this young black man is somehow an anomaly and I resent that.

In this country, if it isn’t streamlined through mainstream media and pop culture, it doesn’t seem to warrant national debate. Our “government” continues to wreak havoc on our civil liberties and there is little to no protest from the black community because of media diversion tactics that keep such pertinent issues out of mainstream media. But if Jay-Z or Rihanna were to make mention of it, we’d suddenly be jolted out of our sugar comas and protesting on freeways.

My point being, people are up in arms about Trayvon based on regurgitated pundits and manipulated facts aired to elicit emotion while fueling America’s anger and division. That’s how you boost ratings. No different from Piers Morgan’s desperate rant over gun control when he knew his ratings were in the dumps. And from where I stand, anyone who still relies on corporate-owned media pundits to support an argument isn’t equipped to offer worthwhile solutions.

People are using Trayvon Martin’s death as an excuse to project their own deep-seated issues with racism and will not be capable of intelligent, empathetic debate until they’ve cooled down and afforded themselves an education.

Addressing Trayvon without first addressing the absence of critical thinking in our schools, the lack of introspection, the reasons for our low tolerance and our country’s skewed value system does nothing more than create a sounding board for the ignorant. So rather than facilitate more racism outcry, I’d like to address young black people specifically.

I believe we lost that trial for Trayvon long before he was killed. Trayvon was doomed the moment ignorance became synonymous with young black America . We lost that case by using media outlets (music, movies, social media, etc.) as vehicles to perpetuate the same negative images and social issues that destroyed the black community in the first place. When we went on record glorifying violent crime and when we voted for a president we never thought to hold accountable. When we signed on to do reality shows that fed into the media’s stereotypes of black men, we ingrained an image of Trayvon Martin so overwhelming that who he actually may have been didn’t matter anymore.

Don’t you find it peculiar that the same media outlets who have worked so diligently to galvanize the negative stigmas of black men in America are now airing open debates on improving the image of black males in American media? Do you honestly think CNN is using their competitive time slots for philanthropy?

“You never want a serious crisis to go to waste.” – Rahm Emanuel

If we really wanted to ensure Trayvon Martin’s killing was not in vain, we’d stop perpetuating negative images that are now synonymous with black men in America. We’d stop rapping about selling drugs and killing niggas. The next time we saw a man beating a woman, we’d call for help or break it up, but one thing we would not do is stand by with our cellphones out — yelling WORLDSTAR! Instead of rewarding kids for memorization, we’d reward them for independent and critical thinking.

We’d spend less time subconsciously repeating lyrics about death and murder and more time understanding why we are so willing to twerk to songs that bemean women and boast of having things we cannot afford. We’d set examples of self-love for our youth by honoring our own hair, skin and eye color. We’d stop spending money on designer gear that we should be spending on our physical and psychological health. We’d seek information outside the corporate owned-media that manipulates us. We’d stop letting television babysit our kids and we’d quit regurgitating pundits we haven’t come up with on our own.

Education, introspection, self-love and excellence are the only ways to overcome the wrath of ignorance. So before going back to popping molly and getting Turnt Up, I urge you to consider the implications of your actions. Your child’s life may depend on it.
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  #58  
Old 07-21-2013, 11:44 PM
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Amen to that, Ben, thanks for posting it. I think that's something with which we can all agree.
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  #59  
Old 07-22-2013, 02:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Neezar View Post
He told his girlfriend that he was going to try to lose the guy following him. I'm not sure I would want to lead someone following me to my front door.

Yeah, and about those 4 mins. What was Zimmerman doing? Did it take him 4 mins to look for a street sign and start back to his car? He has given them exact directions to his truck. Why not just meet them there?

Martin's girlfriend was on the phone with him until 1 min before 911 calls about a fight. She says he was at his father's place, heard the initial confrontation of them meeting up last time. I believe Zimmerman found him there, Martin ran (hence the woman who saw the running of two people 10 feet apart "then later maybe only one, lol" guy ), Zimmerman caught him and then proceeded to get his ass beat.

I believe he shot Martin in self defense but I think he got himself in that position to start with.

Neighborhood watch people are not supposed to follow/pursue. It's in the handbook. lol

I believe this was vigilante justice. However in this case the kid was doing nothing wrong.
So in the absence of fact just insert theory or assumptions? Or worse yet despite the presence of facts insert it anyway?

So let me get this straight... Zimmerman found Martin, Martin ran and Zimmerman caught him??? Seriously? Um... have you seen the two people in question here??? So a fat out of shape Zimmerman chased and actually CAUGHT Martin????

Ok... sure... again NO evidence shows that but we've already established that things like truth, facts and evidence mean nothing to those with an agenda. So... Zimmerman catches him... what then? Martin has ZERO injuries besides the gunshot... Zimmerman has Zero marks on his hands/knuckles to indicate he ever struck Martin, even once.


Quote:
I believe he shot Martin in self defense but I think he got himself in that position to start with.
Unless the position you're referring to is laying on the ground and waiting for Martin to slam his head into a sidewalk then no, he didn't.

Quote:
Neighborhood watch people are not supposed to follow/pursue. It's in the handbook. lol
I know facts don't matter but Zimmerman wasn't "on duty" that night and wasn't acting as part of the neighborhood watch. So while technically he was part of it he wasn't on that night.

Quote:
I believe he shot Martin in self defense.....I believe this was vigilante justice.
Which is it? Can't be both.

Quote:
However in this case the kid was doing nothing wrong.
Other than starting the physical altercation by sucker punching Zimmerman in the nose, getting on top of him, raining down punches and ultimately slamming his head into a sidewalk multiple times right???
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  #60  
Old 07-22-2013, 04:08 AM
Bonnie Bonnie is offline
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Romany Malco

Thanks for posting that, Ben.
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Last edited by Bonnie; 07-22-2013 at 06:54 AM.
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