Secular music in the church

[PRShrek]

Originally Posted by NateR

I don't have a problem with church buildings. I simply have a problem with calling a church building the "house of GOD." That's just bad theology because it elevates the building to a level of reverence that it was never intended to have and it limits GOD in the minds of the people who believe that.

I think it leads to the "Sunday morning Christians" who put on a good show while they are inside the church, but give no evidence whatsoever of a Christ-like life outside of the church building.

Those are excellent points, but I think it can be helpful for people who are not aware of the presence of God in their daily lives to have a place where that presence is brought to their attention. Many people react to that by worshiping the building or the Bible or the pastor or the music, others do everything right on Sunday morning but don't have the strength to take that to work on Monday. But I think if that is as close to Jesus as they ever get, well, we can only do what we can do.

[NateR]

Originally Posted by PRShrek

Those are excellent points, but I think it can be helpful for people who are not aware of the presence of God in their daily lives to have a place where that presence is brought to their attention. Many people react to that by worshiping the building or the Bible or the pastor or the music, others do everything right on Sunday morning but don't have the strength to take that to work on Monday. But I think if that is as close to Jesus as they ever get, well, we can only do what we can do.

I disagree that a church is "as close to Jesus as they ever get" when it comes to unbelievers.

The Great Commission isn't Jesus telling Christians, "Do everything you can to get sinners inside the church building. I don't care what you have to promise them in order to coerce or lure them in there, just make sure that they sit there for an hour on a Sunday morning and that's it."

The Great Commission is Jesus sending us out into the world to meet sinners were they are at. So when you go to your job, just remember that you are to be a reflection of Christ, thus your workplace is as close to Jesus as some of those people will ever get. The same would be true when we are at school, college, restaurants, baseball games, movie theaters, etc.

[PRShrek]

Originally Posted by NateR

I disagree that a church is "as close to Jesus as they ever get" when it comes to unbelievers.

I didn’t say that, and yes, I disagree with that also. If you think that all churches are ‘sit there for an hour on a Sunday morning and that's it’ churches, I can see why you would have a problem with that.

By the way, if you don’t go to a church, in what venue do you fellowship with your fellow Christians, if you do?

Originally Posted by NateR

The Great Commission is Jesus sending us out into the world to meet sinners were they are at. So when you go to your job, just remember that you are to be a reflection of Christ, thus your workplace is as close to Jesus as some of those people will ever get. The same would be true when we are at school, college, restaurants, baseball games, movie theaters, etc.

Absolutely, and well said.

[NateR]

Originally Posted by PRShrek

I didn’t say that, and yes, I disagree with that also. If you think that all churches are ‘sit there for an hour on a Sunday morning and that's it’ churches, I can see why you would have a problem with that.

By the way, if you don’t go to a church, in what venue do you fellowship with your fellow Christians, if you do?

I'm a member of the Presbyterian Church here and I try to be active within the congregation. I help run the projection system during the services and I recently joined the Music & Worship committee ironically enough.

I just think that some Christians get so hung up on the idea of the Church as a building that they believe their primary mission is to get people inside those doors no matter what and that's where their obligation ends. Jesus counts the number of heads they bring in the door, punches their spiritual scorecard, and they are then free to do whatever they want after that. Which includes ignoring the guests they just brought in the door.

As a kid who grew up in the Church, I saw that kind of attitude a lot in many of the "seeker friendly" churches we got stuck in occasionally. People were encouraged to do whatever was necessary to get others into the church building for big events and then they would have some kind of staged entertainment designed to make people happy and excited. And if someone got really happy and really excited, then they might think, "Hey, I really like this whole Jesus thing, I think I will become a Christian."

All that creates is false, carnal Christians who are only into the Church for what they can personally get out of it.

[Tyburn]

Originally Posted by NateR

Which includes ignoring the guests they just brought in the door.

That used to happen to me at the American Pentecostal Church of The Last Harvest...My friend would take me inside...and then he would get "overcome" by the Spirit and I was left to hide in a little corner whilst watching his young son writhing and frothing at the mouth at the front of the Church.

Infact...my friend was actually ANGRY at me when I wanted to go home early and he had to take me out of the building and direct me to the bus stop (I didnt know where it was) I was keeping him from his spiritual diet no doubt...

[Tyburn]

...but back to music...this is perhaps one of the most powerful pieces of music ive heard which deserves to be played in every church during passiontide

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lSe35HZpZls

[Conrad]

Originally Posted by NateR

...

Worship isn't for our benefit or entertainment, it's for GOD and GOD alone. Anytime worship gets contaminated by our own personal interests, then it's no longer worship, it's idolatry.

Sweet! You who liked this (three weeks ago) are not alone!

Originally Posted by adamt

nate, i cannot believe how close our convictions are to each other, this may be the best post this year..... all i have to say to this is amen

Originally Posted by Pastor Chris F

Well truth always bears witness and sometimes convictions can be a good thing. As Nate said it is all about God not out entertainment.

Originally Posted by NateR

Not just in a church building. Every word, deed, thought and intention of a Christian should be focused on Christ every moment of their life for the rest of their life.

Of course, it's an impossible standard for us to keep, which is why we need Christ, but it's the minimum that GOD requires. GOD never lowers His standards to accommodate people and neither should we.

Originally Posted by NateR

I disagree that a church is "as close to Jesus as they ever get" when it comes to unbelievers.

The Great Commission isn't Jesus telling Christians, "Do everything you can to get sinners inside the church building. I don't care what you have to promise them in order to coerce or lure them in there, just make sure that they sit there for an hour on a Sunday morning and that's it."

The Great Commission is Jesus sending us out into the world to meet sinners were they are at. So when you go to your job, just remember that you are to be a reflection of Christ, thus your workplace is as close to Jesus as some of those people will ever get. The same would be true when we are at school, college, restaurants, baseball games, movie theaters, etc.

One church I recently attended one week used Beatles parodies, where they tweak only some of the words, maybe 20%, to make it "worshipy." It was somewhat uncomfortable, like they were cool for using Beatles and "fixing" it. Relating to the last post quoted, does it seem like too many have twisted being "all things to all men," what Paul said he did, into a form of "Do as the Romans do" ? That's not what Paul meant.