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Old 06-07-2011, 04:59 PM
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Neezar Neezar is offline
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Default Harassment or Freedom of Speech?

http://beta.news.yahoo.com/jilted-ex...194142831.html

Jilted ex-boyfriend puts up abortion billboard




ALAMOGORDO, N.M. (AP) — A New Mexico man's decision to lash out with a billboard ad saying his ex-girlfriend had an abortion against his wishes has touched off a legal debate over free speech and privacy rights.

The sign on Alamogordo's main thoroughfare shows 35-year-old Greg Fultz holding the outline of an infant. The text reads, "This Would Have Been A Picture Of My 2-Month Old Baby If The Mother Had Decided To Not KILL Our Child!"

Fultz's ex-girlfriend has taken him to court for harassment and violation of privacy. A domestic court official has recommended the billboard be removed.

But Fultz's attorney argues the order violates his client's free speech rights.

"As distasteful and offensive as the sign may be to some, for over 200 years in this country the First Amendment protects distasteful and offensive speech," Todd Holmes said.

The woman's friends say she had a miscarriage, not an abortion, according to a report in the Albuquerque Journal.

Holmes disputes that, saying his case is based on the accuracy of his client's statement.
"My argument is: What Fultz said is the truth," Holmes said.

The woman's lawyer said she had not discussed the pregnancy with her client. But for Ellen Jessen, whether her client had a miscarriage or an abortion is not the point. The central issue is her client's privacy and the fact that the billboard has caused severe emotional distress, Jessen said.
"Her private life is not a matter of public interest," she told the Alamogordo Daily News.

Jessen says her client's ex-boyfriend has crossed the line.
"Nobody is stopping him from talking about father's rights. ... but a person can't invade someone's private life."

For his part, Holmes invoked the U.S. Supreme Court decision from earlier this year concerning the Westboro Baptist Church, which is known for its anti-gay protests at military funerals and other high-profile events. He believes the high court's decision to allow the protests, as hurtful as they are, is grounds for his client to put up the abortion billboard.

"Very unpopular offensive speech," he told the Alamogordo Daily News. "The Supreme Court, in an 8 to 1 decision, said that is protected speech."
Holmes says he is going to fight the order to remove the billboard through a District Court appeal.
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  #2  
Old 06-07-2011, 05:21 PM
BamaGrits84
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Legally this is just the same as what Westboro does. The high level of offensiveness some people find in it doesn't make it illegal. And since he is not her healtcare professional and her attorney isn't suing for slander he hasn't done anything legally wrong. Billboards are not coverd under harssing communications and in this case since the communication is not directly to her so I don't see much legal room for her to fight him.

I'm 100% against abortion for ANY reason and think it is completely unfair that women can murder their children without the father having a say so. So while his message is something I agree with, I wonder what his motives are. If his motives are to bring pain to her, he is in the wrong even if the abortion pained him. Revenge is the Lord's, so sayth the Good Book. I read this on foxnews earlier and one of the comments was where someone checked this guy out on facebook. He belonged, according to this one comment, to Facebook groups about witch craft including one that claims Jesus was a witch. I guess I would have to better understand his motives to decide if I supported his actions.
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Old 06-07-2011, 05:29 PM
County Mike
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Agreed Bama. It might not be illegal but what's the point? The only reason i can think of for him doing this is to pain/embarrass the ex and that's just stupid.
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Old 06-07-2011, 06:29 PM
Primadawn
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I read this and my take was that he was trying to bring focus to the point that fathers have no say in whether or not a mother decides to end her pregnancy.

He didn't use her name, so unless people knew the 2 of them personally, it wasn't releasing private info.
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Old 06-07-2011, 06:37 PM
rearnakedchoke
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Originally Posted by Primadawn View Post
I read this and my take was that he was trying to bring focus to the point that fathers have no say in whether or not a mother decides to end her pregnancy.

He didn't use her name, so unless people knew the 2 of them personally, it wasn't releasing private info.
well, in the end, they shouldn't ... abortion is a tough topic to talk about, but in the end, a man shouldn't be able to make a women have a child ..
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Old 06-07-2011, 06:56 PM
BamaGrits84
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Originally Posted by rearnakedchoke View Post
well, in the end, they shouldn't ... abortion is a tough topic to talk about, but in the end, a man shouldn't be able to make a women have a child ..
As a woman and mom I call bull. Carrying the baby doesn't make the child any more a part of the mom than it does the dad. The child was given life by equal parts. What gives the mother any more say so as the the value of the child's life? Because she has to carry him or her for 9 months? So the dad has to deal with his child being murdered because the mom doesn't want to be a parent? It is a selfish view that only 1 person is impacted by pregnancy - the woman. But 3 PEOPLE are involved. Mom dad and baby. "A man shouldn't be able to make a woman have a child", but a woman should be able to murder a baby the father desires to have? I know someone will surely bring up the arguement of men who want women to have babies to control them and to that I saw before you sleep with someone you better figure out what kind of person they are first. If you don't, you made your bed and screwed in it so deal with the fact that your actions just as much as the man's brought a new life into the relationship and don't see murder as a reasonable way to cut all ties with someone you wish you never banged to begin with.
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Old 06-07-2011, 07:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Primadawn View Post
I read this and my take was that he was trying to bring focus to the point that fathers have no say in whether or not a mother decides to end her pregnancy.
and honestly they shouldn't.. IMO.. but the other side of the coin is..if she didn't mis-carry/have an abortion...

Should the father have any say so in how the mother goes about living her life during the pregnancy.. health concerns and such..

just food for thought...

does pregnancy equate to living your life during pregnancy to standards that are not "your own".. even if you find that they disagree with you??
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Old 06-07-2011, 07:02 PM
rearnakedchoke
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Originally Posted by BamaGrits84 View Post
As a woman and mom I call bull. Carrying the baby doesn't make the child any more a part of the mom than it does the dad. The child was given life by equal parts. What gives the mother any more say so as the the value of the child's life? Because she has to carry him or her for 9 months? So the dad has to deal with his child being murdered because the mom doesn't want to be a parent? It is a selfish view that only 1 person is impacted by pregnancy - the woman. But 3 PEOPLE are involved. Mom dad and baby. "A man shouldn't be able to make a woman have a child", but a woman should be able to murder a baby the father desires to have? I know someone will surely bring up the arguement of men who want women to have babies to control them and to that I saw before you sleep with someone you better figure out what kind of person they are first. If you don't, you made your bed and screwed in it so deal with the fact that your actions just as much as the man's brought a new life into the relationship and don't see murder as a reasonable way to cut all ties with someone you wish you never banged to begin with.
shouldn't the man also be responsible for finding out about his women first? what if the man doesn't like the fact that the lady smokes or drinks during pregnancy, should he be able to ensure she doesn't do either? what about eating junk food? i know it ain't the same, but you are still controlling what a person does ... i don't like the idea of abortion, but i also don't like the idea of women being forced into do something they don't want to do ...
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Old 06-07-2011, 07:13 PM
BamaGrits84
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Originally Posted by rearnakedchoke View Post
shouldn't the man also be responsible for finding out about his women first? what if the man doesn't like the fact that the lady smokes or drinks during pregnancy, should he be able to ensure she doesn't do either? what about eating junk food? i know it ain't the same, but you are still controlling what a person does ... i don't like the idea of abortion, but i also don't like the idea of women being forced into do something they don't want to do ...

Yes he should think better than to sleep with a woman who he 1.) is not married to and 2.) doesn't know well enough to know if their morals are similar. So lets say both fail to know the other well enough to have sex. (Which I think is marriage.) Then new life comes into place. Mom and dad didn't decide before they bumped if they wanted kids and here is this baby now on the way. Mom says I don't want a baby. Dad says I do. The right to life for the child should win. I would say the same thing about a father who didn't want to be on the hook for child support for a child he doesn't want that now tries to force an abortion on the woman.

As for someone having something forced on them they don't like, I'm pretty sure babies don't like the pain (proven) and possible fear they feel when being aborted.
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  #10  
Old 06-07-2011, 07:22 PM
adamt adamt is offline
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Originally Posted by rearnakedchoke View Post
, but i also don't like the idea of women being forced into do something they don't want to do ...
really?!?!?!? so should a man have to pay child support if he doesn't want to?? should he have the option of killing the baby within a certain amount of time after it is born? we've all seen the signs that say something like " john doe pay your child support" isn't that the same thing? should child support be banned under the same principles that a man doesn't dictate what a woman and her child can do?

and to be fair, the billboard never mentioned a name, it just said that the mother of his child killed it, maybe he wasn't talking about the lady who sued him, and the lady admitted to it knowing she was the one that killed his baby.... and actually it doesn't say she got an abortion, it says she decided to kill her/his child, that doesn't necessarily mean a doctor did it
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