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  #11  
Old 03-19-2011, 03:55 AM
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but didn't God make them that way? isn't it up to them to fight the temptation of sin? didn't God make us all sinners? or do i have it all wrong ..
I was actually going to touch on this point. I've been thinking about this a lot since I first heard that new Lady Gaga song, Born This Way, and my first thoughts when I heard it was that she has it almost right, she WAS born that way. We are all born sinful, imperfect, corrupted and fallen.

However, the idea that "GOD made them that way" is 100% false. GOD made us perfect and we willingly chose sin and imperfection. Well, technically Adam and Eve chose that in the Garden and cursed the rest of humanity. So, the corruption is not something that GOD created us with, it is a result of rebellion against GOD.

Think of it like a terminal disease that every person on the planet is suffering from. Since both parents have the disease, then every child they conceive will have that disease as well. This is why Jesus had to be born of a virgin, to break that cycle.
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  #12  
Old 03-19-2011, 04:14 AM
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we ARE all born into and with sin. some people have a tendancy to lean toward certain sins and some toward others. Some men struggle with lust, this is a sin they were born with but through God's grace and strength, they can overcome that struggle. The list goes on and on but no matter how its turned or twisted, it is sin and we have a choice.
Ever met someone who just has always had a really bad temper or an anger problem? I know some and have seen them overcome these issues. I understand that homosexuality and issues in that neighborhood are different and sometimes deeper than this but you get the idea. I dont think we all will ever understand. Its kinda like being a drug addict, you dont know unless you've been there. (thats how it was told to me by a pastor who is a former homosexual) We need to pray for them and love them and reach out to them just as the church reaches out to the drunks and drug addicts of the world.
This is alot easier to say than do, I know but its the truth.

BTW, Nice illustration NateR. I guess you are more than just a pretty face.
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Old 03-19-2011, 04:16 AM
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Man, I hope Play the Man chimes in on this one!!
Dude is DEEP!!!
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  #14  
Old 03-19-2011, 05:30 PM
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Sorry, I don't buy that. These people choose to live a life in direct rebellion to GOD's law, and nature's law; then they wonder why that lifestyle leaves them empty and unfulfilled. If they are hurting or in pain, them they have no one to blame but themselves.

This kind of rhetoric is demonically driven, so of course it's going to lash out against GOD and His Church. Saying that's it hurt feelings over GOD's condemnation of the gay lifestyle almost sounds like you are putting the blame for this on GOD Himself. That's dangerously close to blasphemy.
I dont care if you buy it or not...have you ever considered that this IS demonically inspired?? The Devil will see the militancy as a perfect veichal to use against the Church.

They dont "Wonder" Nathan...coz they dont believe in GOD at all....They may have a choice about the lifestyle...but if they have the feelings and no morality that tells them the lifestyle is wrong...they will obviously base their lifestyle around their feelings.

I didnt say I felt that way....and YES IF they believed in GOD, they WOULD blame him...obviously. Its easy enough as Christians to sometimes hold a grudge against something GOD has done...and thats when we know damn well whose to blame...if its easy for us...imagine how much more easy it is for someone who either doesnt know him...or has a warped and twisted version of him.

OF COURSE ITS BLASPHEMY, MILITANT HOMOSEXUALS ARE NOT JUST HEATHEN, THEY ARE ALMOST CERTAINLY ANTI-CHRISTIAN

Sometimes I feel you purposefully dont read my posts
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Old 03-19-2011, 05:37 PM
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Originally Posted by rearnakedchoke View Post
but didn't God make them that way? isn't it up to them to fight the temptation of sin? didn't God make us all sinners? or do i have it all wrong ..
"Born in sin? Come on in!" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2anR5j4UdsE LOL

We were not "made" sinful. We inherit our Sin from a past that was created by our Ancestors. We are Born into Sin....but the original concept of Man and Women, and those first created were without direct sin...however, EVERYTHING Created has the potential to sin...that is called "original sin" We know EVERY HUMAN WILL Sin...even if that Human is a two second old Baby...he hasnt directly sinned YET...but we know that he WILL...it is as much a certainty as that he will die. Infact...he dies because that Original Sin he WAS created with, will at some point be activated.

The key is...GOD doesnt activate it...the Human himself does...He decides to sin. Even Hosts are created with Original Sin...how do we know this? Because if Lucifer had been created without original sin, then he couldnt ever have lead the heavenly revolt.

GOD gave to each the potential to sin...this sin was activated...and now it travels through history right out of Eden.
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  #16  
Old 03-19-2011, 05:47 PM
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However, the idea that "GOD made them that way" is 100% false. GOD made us perfect and we willingly chose sin and imperfection. Well, technically Adam and Eve chose that in the Garden and cursed the rest of humanity. So, the corruption is not something that GOD created us with, it is a result of rebellion against GOD.

This is why Jesus had to be born of a virgin, to break that cycle.
But GOD created them with the ability TO Revolt. Did he cause the Fall? No...but he created with its possibility in mind, because if he had not, there would be no possibility of disobedience

In the same way.. Jesus Carried Original Sin...he just never chose to act on it. How do we know this? because if it was impossible for him to have sinned...then how could Satan have ever tempted him? One who CAN NOT Sin, CAN NOT be Tempted...but one WITH Original Sin, CAN Choose not to sin.

This is why GODs perfection Benchmark is important...its not just that we must choose not to sin....its the fact we must choose NEVER to Sin

Christ could do that, because he was ALSO fully GOD

We can NOT do that because we are only fully Man.

Jesus had to be born of a Virgin, because he had to be conceived without a man. GOD had to take one half of the role of conception...and the Man cant carry the child for gestation. Therefore GOD had to choose the person who could incubate to be the other half. The Virgin is a symbol of purity...AND the offspring CANT be related, or accused of being related to any Man IF she has never been fertilized before.

It hasnt got anything to do with Sin at all IMHO. Thats as flawed a mistake, as the supposition that Mary must also have been without sin, because how can something that was sinful, carry the Christ for His Gestation?? Sin doesnt come into the Virgin, Her conception, or her Birth.

Plus...to be fully Human is to have the ability and choice whether to sin or not...if Christ didnt have that free choice...he wasnt fully Human...and he had to be BOTH FULLY HUMAN AND FULLY GOD at the same time, without comprimising EITHER essence.
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  #17  
Old 03-19-2011, 08:27 PM
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This kind of rhetoric is demonically driven
^^^

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...have you ever considered that this IS demonically inspired??


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Sometimes I feel you purposefully dont read my posts
Now you know how I feel.
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