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  #171  
Old 12-28-2010, 03:04 AM
bradwright
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Originally Posted by adamt View Post
okay, i will listen with an open mind here but you will have to explain two things to me....

1. there are alot of rapists , do they need to be integrated, they should have a right to serve too right?


2. how have they not been integrated? it seems to me this is a gay pride, civil rights, being flamboyant issue, not a "i'm a good soldier, let me serve issue" if they wanted to serve they could have since '93
so you are saying that gays are criminals then....lol.
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  #172  
Old 12-28-2010, 03:08 AM
Crisco
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Originally Posted by adamt View Post
okay, i will listen with an open mind here but you will have to explain two things to me....

1. there are alot of rapists , do they need to be integrated, they should have a right to serve too right?


2. how have they not been integrated? it seems to me this is a gay pride, civil rights, being flamboyant issue, not a "i'm a good soldier, let me serve issue" if they wanted to serve they could have since '93
1. Missed your mark buddy I take it that wasn't very well thought out.

2. Aren't civil rights the priority of every American? Do you honestly think a soldier is going to prance around like a fairy? I'm sorry but if your job is able to be lost because of who your facebook says your in a relationship with there is a problem.
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  #173  
Old 12-28-2010, 03:36 AM
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Depends on which box you're talking about.
As far as this topic goes..

I believe that the Bible has a good many contradictions and I believe that some of what is said in the Bible has been misconstrued... but those are some of the issues I have. SO I fully admit I could be wrong. That's where we differ on topics such as this. I admit the possibility that I could be wrong.. I don't know that you can (not an insult.. just an observation).

But not bring the religious aspect into this..

If feel that homosexuals should be allowed to serve..

Seeing as how "All men are created equal." per Jefferson...
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  #174  
Old 12-28-2010, 02:02 PM
adamt adamt is offline
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Originally Posted by bradwright View Post
so you are saying that gays are criminals then....lol.

see that is where the huge chasm lies within this discussion

some people see sodomy as an abomination

some people don't

wasn't long ago they were and i don't think anyone on here thinks we are evolving up in our enlightenment right now

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Originally Posted by Crisco View Post
1. Missed your mark buddy I take it that wasn't very well thought out.

2. Aren't civil rights the priority of every American? Do you honestly think a soldier is going to prance around like a fairy? I'm sorry but if your job is able to be lost because of who your facebook says your in a relationship with there is a problem.
crisco, if you want to have a good discussion that is fine, underhanded slurs though such as " wasn't very well thought out" will torpedo the thread quickly, cause i greatly want to point out that it was YOUR logic, so a.) you were the one that didn't think it out and b.) you didn't bother thinking about my rebuttal, so there again, you are the one that is not thinking


but to be honest i agree, i "missed the mark" too, i didn't understand that logic when you first used it as an argument


and to your second point.... civil rights??

freedom yes, liberty yes, civil rights no. I hate the civil rights movement. it isn't about freedom at all. civil rights today does more to hurt equality then anything else. If, specifically the blacks, would quit pointing out that they are black and were slaves then maybe the race issue would actually die down. That is the exact same thing we have here with gays.

Gays would, could and have served. The military doesn't check their facebook status. Get real.





hey it wasn't my logic, i just allowed it to run its course, and using the logic that, just because there is alot of them we should integrate them, i applied it to another scenario(rapists) and you guys have a cow...... and i agree, it is stupid logic

same as any scenario you run it with, i understand rapists hurt someone else, but the logic is still seriously flawed. Use it to apply to any thing else. Potheads, children, illegal aliens. There are alot of them too, but should we allow them to serve? They don't and haven't hurt anyone else, they should be able to openly serve, even if somebody turns them in because their facebook says they are a 16 year old illegal, marijuana smuggling mexican, and hey maybe he could call it racism!!!!

Last edited by adamt; 12-28-2010 at 02:09 PM.
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  #175  
Old 12-28-2010, 02:12 PM
adamt adamt is offline
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they should be able to openly serve, even if somebody turns them in because their facebook says they are a 16 year old illegal, marijuana smuggling mexican, and hey maybe he could call it racism!!!!


oh yeah did i mention that kid was a gay, pot smuggling, underaged illegal??

I doubt they deny him serving cause he is gay

but that's what he would claim


anyways,



i think it is about time we let illegals serve, mark my words it is a matter of time
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  #176  
Old 12-28-2010, 02:27 PM
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Originally Posted by bradwright View Post
so you are saying that gays are criminals then....lol.
A better comparison would be pedophiles. Something that is considered a crime right now, but with the way things are going, we will be having this exact same discussion 20-30 years from now about a man's "right" to have sex with a 5-year-old boy.

Don't believe me? Do a search on NAMBLA and read about what they stand for. The most disturbing fact about pedophiles is that the children they victimize are not always unwilling sexual partners.

If you side with the homosexuals now, then you MUST also side with the pedophiles when it comes time for them to demand their "rights." Otherwise, there is a flaw in your logic. Because, LOGICALLY, if a man is born with a preference for men; then, LOGICALLY, a person could also be born with a preference for children, multiple partners, animals, etc. And who are you to deny those people their "civil rights"?

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Originally Posted by Spiritwalker View Post
But not bring the religious aspect into this..

If feel that homosexuals should be allowed to serve..

Seeing as how "All men are created equal." per Jefferson...
I can't help but bring my belief in GOD into this. For those of us who truly believe in GOD and in His Son, Jesus Christ, then there is no way to form an opinion about anything without bringing GOD into it.

I agree that "All men are created equal" but that is a completely separate issue from military service. No one has a right to serve in the military. You might as well claim that those who are born blind, deaf, mentally handicapped, or unable to walk are having their civil rights violated by being denied military service.

This is not a civil rights issue. Those who believe it is have simply fallen for the deception.
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  #177  
Old 12-28-2010, 03:24 PM
Twinsmama
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A better comparison would be pedophiles. Something that is considered a crime right now, but with the way things are going, we will be having this exact same discussion 20-30 years from now about a man's "right" to have sex with a 5-year-old boy.

Don't believe me? Do a search on NAMBLA and read about what they stand for. The most disturbing fact about pedophiles is that the children they victimize are not always unwilling sexual partners.

If you side with the homosexuals now, then you MUST also side with the pedophiles when it comes time for them to demand their "rights." Otherwise, there is a flaw in your logic. Because, LOGICALLY, if a man is born with a preference for men; then, LOGICALLY, a person could also be born with a preference for children, multiple partners, animals, etc. And who are you to deny those people their "civil rights"?



I can't help but bring my belief in GOD into this. For those of us who truly believe in GOD and in His Son, Jesus Christ, then there is no way to form an opinion about anything without bringing GOD into it.

I agree that "All men are created equal" but that is a completely separate issue from military service. No one has a right to serve in the military. You might as well claim that those who are born blind, deaf, mentally handicapped, or unable to walk are having their civil rights violated by being denied military service.

This is not a civil rights issue. Those who believe it is have simply fallen for the deception.
totally agree. we are too scared to hurt feelings and make people feel different.
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  #178  
Old 12-28-2010, 03:45 PM
Crisco
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You can't compare being a gay and being a pedo to each other no matter how far we try to stretch it.


2 Consenting adults are very different then an adult and a consenting 5 yr old Nate.

And Adam I am being very real. If someone in your unit reports you under DADT to the military they will research your background to see if you are infact a homo and they can infact discharge you. Read the news bro the system has been abused in the past.

And Adam I'm not saying that it is racist to block gays from service they are not a race. I'm saying that it is prejudicial.


And I also disagree that Civil service is not a right.


There are so many jobs in the military that can be made available to handicapped people.

Some like 20 percent of our actual military is involved with real combat. There is a clerk position some where for them. Everyone has the right to serve their country if they want to.

Last edited by Crisco; 12-28-2010 at 03:53 PM.
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  #179  
Old 12-28-2010, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by NateR View Post
A better comparison would be pedophiles. Something that is considered a crime right now, but with the way things are going, we will be having this exact same discussion 20-30 years from now about a man's "right" to have sex with a 5-year-old boy.

Don't believe me? Do a search on NAMBLA and read about what they stand for. The most disturbing fact about pedophiles is that the children they victimize are not always unwilling sexual partners. .
Comparing homosexuality to pedophiles .. cmon Nate..

Quote:
If you side with the homosexuals now, then you MUST also side with the pedophiles when it comes time for them to demand their "rights." Otherwise, there is a flaw in your logic. Because, LOGICALLY, if a man is born with a preference for men; then, LOGICALLY, a person could also be born with a preference for children, multiple partners, animals, etc. And who are you to deny those people their "civil rights"?.
your talking about consenting adults... (or at least that's what I am talking about).. and comparing that to child molestation..



Quote:

I can't help but bring my belief in GOD into this. For those of us who truly believe in GOD and in His Son, Jesus Christ, then there is no way to form an opinion about anything without bringing GOD into it. .
Understood..

Quote:
I agree that "All men are created equal" but that is a completely separate issue from military service. No one has a right to serve in the military. You might as well claim that those who are born blind, deaf, mentally handicapped, or unable to walk are having their civil rights violated by being denied military service..
But to say that they can not serve because of sexual preference is rather poor.. they can fire a gun as well as the next person...

And those with disabilities.. should be able to serve also.. your telling me a blind man, a deaf man, doesn't have any abilities that the military can use? Sure.. not standing on the front lines with a rifle.. but If you are an American.. and want to serve your contry.. it seems that we (as a nation) should be able to find a spot for them. "Ask no what your country can do for you... but what you can do for your country".

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This is not a civil rights issue. Those who believe it is have simply fallen for the deception.
I would agree that it's not a civil rights issue.. it's a pretty lame issue.

Homosexuality is a curb that is "one inch high"..Same as racism.. and some people want to get tripped up by the smallest things.. when there is a much bigger picture... In the US, babies die for lack of food... families are living in cars... US Vets.. are living on streets... (wow.. now you got me sounding like a liberal...)..

There are so much more important things that this country needs to address... Hell.. we had congress looking into baseball and PEDs... WTF!!!... Teach Johnny to read first...

If some gay gay wants to go stand on the line in defense of my freedoms.. live and die trying to protect what they love and belive in... I say we should let them. Because there are WAYYYYYY to many hetrosexuals out there.. that couldn't care less.

A question for all...

If this country were to ever have a draft again... (not that it's really possible with the type of wars that would actually be fought)...do you think that this country would/should turn away a man that wanted to go fight.. in favor of draging a person to the lines..that didn't want to fight?

Which would you rather have beside you..?
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  #180  
Old 12-28-2010, 03:57 PM
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Some like 20 percent of our actual military is involved with real combat. There is a clerk position some where for them. Everyone has the right to serve their country if they want to.
Using the word "right".. just stick to me for some reason...

Everyone should be able to serve their country if they want to.
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