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rockdawg21
11-14-2011, 10:02 PM
I just realized there isn't a thread about this. Looks like now, the season may not start at all. So I suppose the question is, does anybody really care?

Personally, I don't care. I quit watching NBA after Jordan left. I prefer college basketball because they look like they still want to win (or get to the NBA to start making big money) rather than playing lazy and getting a paycheck.

J.B.
11-14-2011, 10:24 PM
LOL, this just reminded me of a thread you made a couple years ago when Floyd signed to fight Marquez and you asked if anybody really cared. :laugh: In retrospect, a lot of people cared, and it clearly holds some more significance after Saturday...but to stay on topic...

YES, people care, and I am certainly one of them.

The NBA had it's most exciting season since the Jordan era last season, and this is terrible timing for both the owners and the players. The news about the union breaking apart and filing a lawsuit adds an extra sense of gloom and doom, but Im still holding out some hope that they find a way to get a deal done before the end of the year.

I don't think it's fair to say or assume guys don't wanna win or just wanna cash a paycheck at the highest levels. Sure, I don't doubt that it happens, or that a guy gets too comfortable once they start making a lot of money, but I think that we see that to a certain degree in all sports.

rockdawg21
11-15-2011, 05:32 PM
LOL, this just reminded me of a thread you made a couple years ago when Floyd signed to fight Marquez and you asked if anybody really cared. :laugh: In retrospect, a lot of people cared, and it clearly holds some more significance after Saturday...but to stay on topic...

YES, people care, and I am certainly one of them.

The NBA had it's most exciting season since the Jordan era last season, and this is terrible timing for both the owners and the players. The news about the union breaking apart and filing a lawsuit adds an extra sense of gloom and doom, but Im still holding out some hope that they find a way to get a deal done before the end of the year.

I don't think it's fair to say or assume guys don't wanna win or just wanna cash a paycheck at the highest levels. Sure, I don't doubt that it happens, or that a guy gets too comfortable once they start making a lot of money, but I think that we see that to a certain degree in all sports.
LOL, well I knew that fight wasn't going to be close at all, but guess maybe I was the only one on the planet who knew it :wink:

Lockouts and those ridiculous millionaires vs. billionaire battles just irk me. I understand some of it with the NFL considering the dangers involved, and honestly can't say I know the details with the NBA since I don't really watch it nor keep up with the news on it.

Just saw that it was an untouched subject on the forum so I brought it up. So far, you're the only one who cares (on this forum) :laugh:

rearnakedchoke
11-15-2011, 05:54 PM
i care a little ... i am sure there will be plenty of entertainment to fill the void .. plus, the raptors suck ...

matthughesfan21
11-15-2011, 10:03 PM
i care a little but not much, just more hockey for me:)

rockdawg21
11-16-2011, 12:08 AM
i care a little but not much, just more hockey for me:)
LOL, a FAR better sport anyways!

Bonnie
11-16-2011, 12:10 AM
What are they squabbling about now? Didn't they just go through a lockout not so long ago? Do they really care as long as they have the cushion of their millions to wait each other out. If it wouldn't end up hurting all the regular joes that are already hurting enough who work the games and depend on that income, I would love to see the fans come together and lock them out.

matthughesfan21
11-20-2011, 11:50 PM
What are they squabbling about now? Didn't they just go through a lockout not so long ago? Do they really care as long as they have the cushion of their millions to wait each other out. If it wouldn't end up hurting all the regular joes that are already hurting enough who work the games and depend on that income, I would love to see the fans come together and lock them out.

Revenue sharing is the issue, and they missed about half of the 98-99 season

The sticking point is the players received 57% of league revenue on the previous collective bargaining agreement, but the owners are offering a 50 50 split at best and the players don't want to reduce that much. But the thing is, 50% would still be one of the best deals in pro sports

J.B.
11-20-2011, 11:52 PM
LOL, a FAR better sport anyways!

wrong :laugh:

J.B.
11-21-2011, 12:07 AM
What are they squabbling about now? Didn't they just go through a lockout not so long ago? Do they really care as long as they have the cushion of their millions to wait each other out. If it wouldn't end up hurting all the regular joes that are already hurting enough who work the games and depend on that income, I would love to see the fans come together and lock them out.

It does seem silly when we think about it in terms of "millionaires and billionaires" arguing over percentages, but I stand behind the players in these situations. The players are the millionaires, not the billionaires, so they can't wait it out too long because the owners have much deeper pockets. The players are also the ones who make the product much more marketable to the fans, especially in the NBA where one or two star players can be the difference between a championship and low end of the totem pole. The players deserve the lions share in my opinion, and I said that about the NFL lockout, and I've said it about professional fighters for years.

Guys who get paid max deals in the NBA make in the area of 20 million bucks for their salary in the highest paid year of their contract, but those stars (Kobe, Lebron, Wade, Howard...) bring in revenue for their teams that FAR exceed that, and I mean FAR....There are reports that say Kobe Bryant has brought the Lakers around 100 million dollars in extra revenue in just one year. That is absurd.

The owners need to be saved from themselves in the NBA, and some of these markets just shouldn't have teams to be quite honest. Basketball is not the same sport as Football, and we will never see the parody in the NBA that we see in the NFL.

J.B.
11-21-2011, 12:11 AM
Revenue sharing is the issue, and they missed about half of the 98-99 season

The sticking point is the players received 57% of league revenue on the previous collective bargaining agreement, but the owners are offering a 50 50 split at best and the players don't want to reduce that much. But the thing is, 50% would still be one of the best deals in pro sports

You are leaving out some key elements.

1)The players came down to like 52 or 53 % because they understand the economy has changed since the last CBA. That roughly came out to something like a half a billion dollars.

2) The 50-50 deal offered by the owners wasn't REALLY 50-50...it was based on certain criteria being met, and the truth is over half the owners did NOT like the deal and didn't want the players to take it. The 50-50 deal and it's "deadline" was just a tactic by Stern and the NBA. They knew that wasnt gonna fly.

matthughesfan21
11-21-2011, 12:15 AM
wrong :laugh:Matter of opinion, but I'd rather watch a junior hockey game over the NBA:laugh:

J.B.
11-21-2011, 12:18 AM
Matter of opinion, but I'd rather watch a junior hockey game over the NBA:laugh:

I love hockey, don't get me wrong, but I think growing up around Chicago in the Jordan era kinda embedded basketball into my DNA. Not everybody appreciates basketball, but for those who do (and its a lot more of the world than hockey), the NBA is the best of the best. :wink:

matthughesfan21
11-21-2011, 12:23 AM
I love hockey, don't get me wrong, but I think growing up around Chicago in the Jordan era kinda embedded basketball into my DNA. Not everybody appreciates basketball, but for those who do (and its a lot more of the world than hockey), the NBA is the best of the best. :wink:I grew up in Illinois in the Jordan era, so I loved it too, but its not the same NBA as it was back then. I love watching a few guys play, but in I can hardly sit through an NBA game against two random middle of the pack teams

J.B.
11-21-2011, 12:39 AM
I grew up in Illinois in the Jordan era, so I loved it too, but its not the same NBA as it was back then. I love watching a few guys play, but in I can hardly sit through an NBA game against two random middle of the pack teams

Last season was as exciting as it's been since the 90's. I agree, some teams are tough to watch, but the NFL and MLB is like that too.

The 80's and 90's were so good, we were spoiled as NBA fans. Thats not to say the talent in the last decade isn't great, because it is, I just think that Jordan impacted the game so much on a global scale it was hard to go anywhere but down after he left for good.

rearnakedchoke
11-21-2011, 04:38 PM
Matter of opinion, but I'd rather watch a junior hockey game over the NBA:laugh:

yes, matter of opinion .. i grew up here in canada and still can't watch hockey ... to me its just a boring game, just like some see basketball, soccer etc as boring ... well, i shouldn't say i can't watch hockey .. love international hockey at the pro and jr. levels ... something about playing for ones country and brings out the beast ... LOL

J.B.
11-26-2011, 09:54 PM
NBA is back!!! :happydancing:

Can't wait to go buy some Suns tickets

J.B.
11-26-2011, 10:01 PM
Players gave back around 1.2 billion dollars. I feel like they got shafted, but as a fan I'm just happy to have basketball again.

Chris F
11-26-2011, 10:13 PM
JB it is real hard to care when they are crying that hudreds of thousands and some millions of dollars are not enough to put a ball in a hoop. When entertainers of all persuasion get paid more than teachers and such you know America has a screwed up value system. I love the NBA but this lock out was stupid.

Chris F
11-26-2011, 10:16 PM
I love hockey, don't get me wrong, but I think growing up around Chicago in the Jordan era kinda embedded basketball into my DNA. Not everybody appreciates basketball, but for those who do (and its a lot more of the world than hockey), the NBA is the best of the best. :wink:

As a Knick fan from the 90's I hate everything there is about Jordan. :) He was the epitome of a Ball hog and Phil Jackson is an idiot. :laugh: Now I feel better

J.B.
11-27-2011, 12:06 AM
JB it is real hard to care when they are crying that hudreds of thousands and some millions of dollars are not enough to put a ball in a hoop. When entertainers of all persuasion get paid more than teachers and such you know America has a screwed up value system. I love the NBA but this lock out was stupid.

Hey, I hated this lockout too, but it's not fair to compare industries when it comes to professional athletes and teachers. Teachers get paid according to how it plays out in the grand scheme of the budget in a local area based on taxes.. The NBA generates billions of dollars all over the world independently. It's real easy to criticize throwing a ball in a hoop, but if you or I could do it better we would be, and we would be getting paid good to do it because it's a product that people WANT to spend money on.

Sure, there a lot of teachers that contribute more to the world than basketball can, but there are also a lot of teachers who ain't worth crap but they get paid just the same or even more sometimes than those who are better. Just like the NBA. The biggest problem with players contracts recently has been B-level guys getting WAY overpaid in terms of contribution to the team.

We all hate the idea of "billionaires arguing millionaires", especially when most of us barely have a pot to piss in, but the fact is that this is capitalism. I prefer this over living in North Korea :laugh:

J.B.
11-27-2011, 12:44 AM
As a Knick fan from the 90's I hate everything there is about Jordan. :) He was the epitome of a Ball hog and Phil Jackson is an idiot. :laugh: Now I feel better

Do you really feel better? ::rolleyes:

Because the Knicks still got nothing in the Ewing era. :laugh:

Jordan is the ultimate ball-hog, and I wouldn't have it any other way. Maybe it's just me, and I have some "trust issues", but there isn't a person walking the Earth I trust more than Michael Jordan with a basketball in his hands. I will admit, I am totally, completely, 100% biased about this issue. Michael Jordan is the best basketball player EVER. :wink:

rearnakedchoke
11-27-2011, 09:29 PM
Do you really feel better? ::rolleyes:

Because the Knicks still got nothing in the Ewing era. :laugh:

Jordan is the ultimate ball-hog, and I wouldn't have it any other way. Maybe it's just me, and I have some "trust issues", but there isn't a person walking the Earth I trust more than Michael Jordan with a basketball in his hands. I will admit, I am totally, completely, 100% biased about this issue. Michael Jordan is the best basketball player EVER. :wink:

i hated jordan growing up ... before the raptors, i was a piston fan and although they roughed him up good, he had the last laugh (especially making sure isaiah wasn't on the dream team) ... but yeah, he is the greatest ball player ever ... guys like kobe, lebron ... they can't even be mentioned in the same sentence ...

Chris F
11-28-2011, 01:06 AM
Hey, I hated this lockout too, but it's not fair to compare industries when it comes to professional athletes and teachers. Teachers get paid according to how it plays out in the grand scheme of the budget in a local area based on taxes.. The NBA generates billions of dollars all over the world independently. It's real easy to criticize throwing a ball in a hoop, but if you or I could do it better we would be, and we would be getting paid good to do it because it's a product that people WANT to spend money on.

Sure, there a lot of teachers that contribute more to the world than basketball can, but there are also a lot of teachers who ain't worth crap but they get paid just the same or even more sometimes than those who are better. Just like the NBA. The biggest problem with players contracts recently has been B-level guys getting WAY overpaid in terms of contribution to the team.

We all hate the idea of "billionaires arguing millionaires", especially when most of us barely have a pot to piss in, but the fact is that this is capitalism. I prefer this over living in North Korea :laugh:

It it were true capitalism than the players would not be able to unionize and force the hands of the greedy owners. The real problem is not the player or the owners it is the fan who shovel the money into it and cause them a reason to whine. :wink:

Chris F
11-28-2011, 01:09 AM
Do you really feel better? ::rolleyes:

Because the Knicks still got nothing in the Ewing era. :laugh:

Jordan is the ultimate ball-hog, and I wouldn't have it any other way. Maybe it's just me, and I have some "trust issues", but there isn't a person walking the Earth I trust more than Michael Jordan with a basketball in his hands. I will admit, I am totally, completely, 100% biased about this issue. Michael Jordan is the best basketball player EVER. :wink:

Yeah that era was filled of what if's and not there yet. Even when they had it in their court they tanked to the rockets. I was a Knick fan mostly because when I played in college they nick named me John Starks. I played with a lot of emotion and lived and dies by my 3 point shot. I even head butted a guy in a game just like he did to Reggie Miller. It was so bad they even made me wear #3 :laugh: So yes I hate Jordan and Jackson with a passion. And like you I am 100% biased. :)

J.B.
11-28-2011, 11:52 PM
It it were true capitalism than the players would not be able to unionize and force the hands of the greedy owners. The real problem is not the player or the owners it is the fan who shovel the money into it and cause them a reason to whine. :wink:

The same could be said for many industries. :laugh:

I'm not the biggest fan of unions, and they can be just as greedy and corrupt as anything else in this world. Heck, even in this case some people could make the argument that Derek Fisher (head of the players union) doesn't have the long term interests of the players in mind because he's at the end of his playing career. However, I will say that professional sports and most other unionized industries are typically FAR apart in terms of how replaceable the "workers" are. For example, it's a lot easier to teach somebody how to work on an assembly line in Detroit making cars than it is to be one of the 450 men in the world who get to put on an NBA jersey every season.

I get your point though, and I can't say I disagree with anything you said.

J.B.
11-28-2011, 11:57 PM
Yeah that era was filled of what if's and not there yet. Even when they had it in their court they tanked to the rockets. I was a Knick fan mostly because when I played in college they nick named me John Starks. I played with a lot of emotion and lived and dies by my 3 point shot. I even head butted a guy in a game just like he did to Reggie Miller. It was so bad they even made me wear #3 :laugh: So yes I hate Jordan and Jackson with a passion. And like you I am 100% biased. :)

So as a Knick fan, what do you think of the current team?

Personally, I will always be an Amar'e Stoudimire fan, so I am kinda pulling for the Knicks right now (even though I'm already a Bulls and a Suns guy lol). You guys also have D'antoni, who basically groomed Amar'e and the Suns 8 second offense, not to mention picking up Carmelo Anthony. It's too bad the Chris Paul thing didn't happen, because that would have set up an awesome storyline in the East for seasons to come.

Chris F
11-29-2011, 04:11 PM
So as a Knick fan, what do you think of the current team?

Personally, I will always be an Amar'e Stoudimire fan, so I am kinda pulling for the Knicks right now (even though I'm already a Bulls and a Suns guy lol). You guys also have D'antoni, who basically groomed Amar'e and the Suns 8 second offense, not to mention picking up Carmelo Anthony. It's too bad the Chris Paul thing didn't happen, because that would have set up an awesome storyline in the East for seasons to come.

TBH I have not watched much. Now that I am in Oklahoma I tend to follow the Thunder more. However my wife makes it a point when we can afford it to get me Thunder vs Knicks tickets for my birthday because they always play around that time. The new team is a lot stronger than they have been for the last 5 years. So we will see this year.