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View Full Version : 6-year-old committed to psych ward against mom's wishes


rockdawg21
02-15-2011, 07:25 PM
More proof that liberals suck, always trying to tell people how to live their lives, raise their children, etc.

http://moms.today.com/_news/2011/02/15/6058506-6-year-old-committed-to-psych-ward-against-moms-wishes?gt1=43001
6-year-old committed to psych ward against mom's wishes

By Rebecca Dube

Have you seen this story about a 6-year-old boy who was committed to a psych ward for 48 hours because of a violent picture he drew at school -- against his mother's wishes?

A six-year-old California boy was institutionalized for 48 hours after drawing a violent picture at school. NBC's Kim Baldonado reports.

Experts say this could happen to any parent: Mental health professionals have the power to put any child in a 72-hour psych hold, without the parents' permission, if they think it's necessary.

In 6-year-old Jack Dorman's case, he drew a violent picture and wrote that he wanted to die. Syndi Dorman says her son suffers from separation anxiety and was having a rough time because her husband was in the midst of being deployed to Iraq. She says she told school officials she would get him to a therapist that day, but they said it was out of her hands and an ambulance was already on its way.

According to NBC Los Angeles:

Dorman said the ambulance ride was traumatizing for her son.

"I was trying to reassure him it would be OK and he asked if I'd come back for him, and I said of course I'm going to come back for you."

Los Angeles Unified School District Superintendent Ramon Cortines released a statement, saying in part, "When any student indicates a desire to take his or her own life, the LAUSD is required to follow strict protocols to ensure the safety of the student ... The safety of LAUSD students is paramount. We did the right thing here."

Dorman says that Jack is scared to go back to school, and she's considering home schooling -- can you blame her? What would you do if this happened to your child?

NateR
02-15-2011, 07:36 PM
Wait, the kid suffers from separation anxiety and the solution is to take him away from his mother for 72 hours? :blink: That mother definitely needs to consider home schooling. Those school officials are obviously idiots and they're just making the situation worse.

Miss Foxy
02-15-2011, 07:42 PM
I wonder if there's more to the story like if the child has also been doing other things at school to make them alarmed that they legally can't disclose. I think it's quick to read an article then blame the educators.

Spiritwalker
02-15-2011, 07:45 PM
When you have parents leaving their 7 month old kids in a car to get a tan.. (yes it happened) and such.. I question if there was already consuling happening.. if that's the case, the first person contacted should be the kids therapist.. so all is good.

I understand the schools intent.. and fear in a lawsuit happy world..

but if it was my kid....

"OK.. ambulance is here yet??"

"nope"

"OK.. see you later..." and take my kid by the hand and walk right out the door. And fear what happens to the person that tries to stop me.

DonnaMaria
02-15-2011, 07:47 PM
it is a messed up situation but our country created it.

so many parents sue school districts over little things that schools are making decisions to cover their butts legally. the sad truth is that if the child HAD hurt himself and the school knew about it but didn't send him to a psych ward, the parents could sue the school for negligence.

it's the reason why i am required to question every little bump and bruise on a child and document it.

VCURamFan
02-15-2011, 07:50 PM
it is a messed up situation but our country created it.

so many parents sue school districts over little things that schools are making decisions to cover their butts legally. the sad truth is that if the child HAD hurt himself and the school knew about it but didn't send him to a psych ward, the parents could sue the school for negligence.

it's the reason why i am required to question every little bump and bruise on a child and document it.
I really hate living in an overly litigous society.

That being said, I'm also thankful that the country's educators are being watchful over the children placed in their care.

Spiritwalker
02-15-2011, 07:58 PM
I really hate living in an overly litigous society.

That being said, I'm also thankful that the country's educators are being watchful over the children placed in their care.



Yeah.. but some educators... shouldn't be there..


And some rules are being mal-used

http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?section=news/local&id=7392273
HOUSTON (KTRK) -- A 13-year-old girl was suspended from school after she was accused of threatening her teacher. Her family says it's a misunderstanding under a zero tolerance policy.


Related Content
More: Got a story idea? Let us know!
Bleyl Middle School student Taylor Trostle and her parents say it's a classroom game that got her kicked out of school, and now has her labeled as a "terrorist."

"I was shocked because it just seems ludicrous and appalling," Bleyl Middle School student Taylor Trostle's mother, Kristin Trostle, said.

When Kristin Trostle and her fiancee got a phone call from the principal's office at her daughter's school, they knew something was wrong. But the story they got blew them away.

"I mean, terroristic threat, to me that's a serious statement," Kristin Trostle said. "That's one of the most serious things you could say to somebody."

Taylor was wearing an NYPD shirt at school. She says in the last moments of math class, she and some friends were pretending to be police officers.

"I was shooting the markers at the front of the board," Taylor Trostle said. "It was just like this and I was like 'pow pow' and then she just turned around."

Taylor was sent to the principal's office and immediately suspended for three days. Her write up says the finger gun was pointed in the teacher's direction.

"That was considered a terroristic threat because the teacher feared for her life," Kristin Trostle said.

According to Cy-Fair ISD's code of conduct, a terroristic threat is a level four violation, which is on par with assault, public lewdness, or selling alcohol or drugs at school. Any threat to a teacher falls under a 'zero tolerance policy.'

"Now she's got a very serious mark on her record and she's labeled," Kristin Trostle said.

Cy-Fair ISD denied our repeated requests for comment, so did Taylor Trostle's 7th grade math teacher. Now- Taylor Trostle says she's being mocked at school, for a silly game that got her kicked out.




http://www.nydailynews.com/news/2010/03/06/2010-03-06_boy_6_gets_suspended_from_school_after_making_g un_sign_with_fingers_pointing_at_.html


Boy, 6, gets suspended from school after making gun sign with fingers, pointing at classmates
BY Rachel Monahan
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITER

Saturday, March 6th 2010, 1:14 PM

It's handgun control in the extreme.

A Michigan kindergartener's make-believe gun - which he created with just his fingers - got him suspended, the Grand Rapids Press reported.

Mason Jammer, 6, who attends Ionia's Jefferson Elementary School, pointed his finger-gun at a fellow student Wednesday and got kicked out of school till Friday.

School officials said they had given Mason numerous warnings over several months, and his gun play created discomfort for other kids.

Mason's mom said the suspension is "too harsh" for a young boy.

"He's only six, and he doesn't understand any of this," said Erin Jammer, who suggested there were more fitting punishments.
"Maybe what you could do is take his recess away."

Mason doesn't even have toy guns at home, said his mom. "He's six, and he just likes to play," said Jammer.


http://everything2.com/title/Boy+suspended+for+pointing+chicken+finger+like+gun

Eight year-old Christopher Kissinger from Jonesboro, Arkansas was suspended from school last week for pointing a chicken finger from the school's cafeteria at a teacher and saying "Pow, pow, pow." The boy received a three day suspension.
The Jonesboro School District has a zero tolerance policy against weapons, and the chicken finger apparently violated that policy in this incident. According to South Elementary principal Dan Sullivan, the punishment "depends on the tone, the demeanor, and in some manner you judge the intent. It's not the object in the hand, it's the thought in the mind. Is a plastic fork worse than a metal fork? Is a pencil a weapon?"

Unfortunately, Christopher's case isn't unique. Zero tolerance policies against weapons in schools have gone too far since various high-profile incidents of violence in high schools throughout the US. Ben Ratner was expelled from Blue Ridge Middle School in Virginia for violating his school's weapons policy after he took a knife away from a friend who was threatening suicide. A 15-year-old Florida student was suspended because his nail clippers included a file.

I'm all for keeping weapons out of schools, but shouldn't we wait for students to bring the weapon before we suspend them?

DonnaMaria
02-15-2011, 08:05 PM
Yeah.. but some educators... shouldn't be there..


And some rules are being mal-used

http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?section=news/local&id=7392273
HOUSTON (KTRK) -- A 13-year-old girl was suspended from school after she was accused of threatening her teacher. Her family says it's a misunderstanding under a zero tolerance policy.


Related Content
More: Got a story idea? Let us know!
Bleyl Middle School student Taylor Trostle and her parents say it's a classroom game that got her kicked out of school, and now has her labeled as a "terrorist."

"I was shocked because it just seems ludicrous and appalling," Bleyl Middle School student Taylor Trostle's mother, Kristin Trostle, said.

When Kristin Trostle and her fiancee got a phone call from the principal's office at her daughter's school, they knew something was wrong. But the story they got blew them away.

"I mean, terroristic threat, to me that's a serious statement," Kristin Trostle said. "That's one of the most serious things you could say to somebody."

Taylor was wearing an NYPD shirt at school. She says in the last moments of math class, she and some friends were pretending to be police officers.

"I was shooting the markers at the front of the board," Taylor Trostle said. "It was just like this and I was like 'pow pow' and then she just turned around."

Taylor was sent to the principal's office and immediately suspended for three days. Her write up says the finger gun was pointed in the teacher's direction.

"That was considered a terroristic threat because the teacher feared for her life," Kristin Trostle said.

According to Cy-Fair ISD's code of conduct, a terroristic threat is a level four violation, which is on par with assault, public lewdness, or selling alcohol or drugs at school. Any threat to a teacher falls under a 'zero tolerance policy.'

"Now she's got a very serious mark on her record and she's labeled," Kristin Trostle said.

Cy-Fair ISD denied our repeated requests for comment, so did Taylor Trostle's 7th grade math teacher. Now- Taylor Trostle says she's being mocked at school, for a silly game that got her kicked out.




http://www.nydailynews.com/news/2010/03/06/2010-03-06_boy_6_gets_suspended_from_school_after_making_g un_sign_with_fingers_pointing_at_.html


Boy, 6, gets suspended from school after making gun sign with fingers, pointing at classmates
BY Rachel Monahan
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITER

Saturday, March 6th 2010, 1:14 PM

It's handgun control in the extreme.

A Michigan kindergartener's make-believe gun - which he created with just his fingers - got him suspended, the Grand Rapids Press reported.

Mason Jammer, 6, who attends Ionia's Jefferson Elementary School, pointed his finger-gun at a fellow student Wednesday and got kicked out of school till Friday.

School officials said they had given Mason numerous warnings over several months, and his gun play created discomfort for other kids.

Mason's mom said the suspension is "too harsh" for a young boy.

"He's only six, and he doesn't understand any of this," said Erin Jammer, who suggested there were more fitting punishments.
"Maybe what you could do is take his recess away."

Mason doesn't even have toy guns at home, said his mom. "He's six, and he just likes to play," said Jammer.


http://everything2.com/title/Boy+suspended+for+pointing+chicken+finger+like+gun

Eight year-old Christopher Kissinger from Jonesboro, Arkansas was suspended from school last week for pointing a chicken finger from the school's cafeteria at a teacher and saying "Pow, pow, pow." The boy received a three day suspension.
The Jonesboro School District has a zero tolerance policy against weapons, and the chicken finger apparently violated that policy in this incident. According to South Elementary principal Dan Sullivan, the punishment "depends on the tone, the demeanor, and in some manner you judge the intent. It's not the object in the hand, it's the thought in the mind. Is a plastic fork worse than a metal fork? Is a pencil a weapon?"

Unfortunately, Christopher's case isn't unique. Zero tolerance policies against weapons in schools have gone too far since various high-profile incidents of violence in high schools throughout the US. Ben Ratner was expelled from Blue Ridge Middle School in Virginia for violating his school's weapons policy after he took a knife away from a friend who was threatening suicide. A 15-year-old Florida student was suspended because his nail clippers included a file.

I'm all for keeping weapons out of schools, but shouldn't we wait for students to bring the weapon before we suspend them?

I agree. But again, it's a symptom of a dumbed down society. The parents need to rally against crap like this! And stand up for their kids!

I know that my school has a policy that has zero tolerance against fighting........but i tell my girls to defend themselves if they are ever hit. I'll deal with the policy myself.

VCURamFan
02-15-2011, 08:07 PM
I agree. But again, it's a symptom of a dumbed down society. The parents need to rally against crap like this! And stand up for their kids!

I know that my school has a policy that has zero tolerance against fighting........but i tell my girls to defend themselves if they are ever hit. I'll deal with the policy myself.
My brother teaches HS Physics & has basically the same approach. He's already telling his son (David's only 8 months old) that his Daddy will teach how to never start a fight, but that Uncle Ben will teach him how to finish one. :punch: :laugh:

rockdawg21
02-15-2011, 08:16 PM
Guess I'm going to have to start carrying chicken fingers in my car. Never realized it was such a dangerous weapon, but I'll have to master it now!

Chuck
02-15-2011, 10:40 PM
I'm all for keeping weapons out of schools, but shouldn't we wait for students to bring the weapon before we suspend them?

I think their are a lot of families in Colorado that would disagree with that. Some of the stories you posted seem to be going to one extreme but your comment above seems to be going to the other.

IMO

Miss Foxy
02-15-2011, 10:41 PM
I think their are a lot of families in Colorado that would disagree with that. Some of the stories you posted seem to be going to one extreme but your comment above seems to be going to the other.

IMO

+1

County Mike
02-15-2011, 10:50 PM
The ambulance ride traumatized the kid? Maybe he does need therapy.

At the very least, he needs to go to anti-sissy camp. Tell that boy to harden up.

DonnaMaria
02-18-2011, 03:22 PM
I think their are a lot of families in Colorado that would disagree with that. Some of the stories you posted seem to be going to one extreme but your comment above seems to be going to the other.

IMO

I understand and agree with you about the families in Colorado.........I thought Spirits comment meant that the chicken finger wasn't truly a "weapon" and therefore shouldn't have been given a suspension. That the response was a bit over the top.

It's my understanding that the two boys in Colorado displayed a lot of agressive, violent and anti-social behaviors for a few years prior to the shooting. That they probably should have been suspended for a lot of reasons, including harassing and threatening some students, and never allowed back at school.

Spiritwalker
02-18-2011, 03:38 PM
I think their are a lot of families in Colorado that would disagree with that. Some of the stories you posted seem to be going to one extreme but your comment above seems to be going to the other.

IMO

That wasn't actually my quote.. it was part of one of the stories..

but I do agree with it. pointing a finger as a gun.. is not a weapon..

Spiritwalker
02-18-2011, 03:52 PM
I understand and agree with you about the families in Colorado.........I thought Spirits comment meant that the chicken finger wasn't truly a "weapon" and therefore shouldn't have been given a suspension. That the response was a bit over the top.

Yep


It's my understanding that the two boys in Colorado displayed a lot of agressive, violent and anti-social behaviors for a few years prior to the shooting. That they probably should have been suspended for a lot of reasons, including harassing and threatening some students, and never allowed back at school.

Are we talking about Columbine?

There was ALOT wrong with those "kids".. 18 and 17 if I remember correctly... they were gifted students.. and "bullied" for years.. never in any trouble in schools that I remember.. they were depressed.. drug use.. (both legal and illegal)... I personally find most of the fault or that to the parents being so disconnected from their kids that tey were able to plan all of that...

Miss Foxy
02-18-2011, 03:58 PM
Yep



Are we talking about Columbine?

There was ALOT wrong with those "kids".. 18 and 17 if I remember correctly... they were gifted students.. and "bullied" for years.. never in any trouble in schools that I remember.. they were depressed.. drug use.. (both legal and illegal)... I personally find most of the fault or that to the parents being so disconnected from their kids that tey were able to plan all of that...

Word!!

DonnaMaria
02-18-2011, 04:03 PM
Here is something I found

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2009-04-13-columbine-myths_N.htm

Miss Foxy
02-18-2011, 04:09 PM
Here is something I found

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2009-04-13-columbine-myths_N.htm

Well regardless if they were bullied or were the bullys the parents should have paid more attention and seen something. It's not 100% their faults, but as parents we have to pay attention to our children. Just like that nutjob in Tucson same thing..Signs, signs, and more signs..Ignored..

VCURamFan
02-18-2011, 04:10 PM
Here is something I found

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2009-04-13-columbine-myths_N.htm
That is some chilling stuff to read.

Miss Foxy
02-18-2011, 04:13 PM
The ambulance ride traumatized the kid? Maybe he does need therapy.

At the very least, he needs to go to anti-sissy camp. Tell that boy to harden up.

I agree!! My kids are both military children and when dad was gone or is gone.. Mom steps in!!!! :punch: They know and understand his job and that he still loves them, but also needs them to take care of mom..:)

rockdawg21
02-18-2011, 04:22 PM
Here is something I found

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2009-04-13-columbine-myths_N.htm
Good, now this article proves to all the jackass parents and reporters that Marilyn Manson had nothing to do with this. :rolleyes:

flo
02-18-2011, 07:53 PM
At the very least, he needs to go to anti-sissy camp.

:laugh: Love it!

What did the poor kid draw? A stick figure with a gun? Sheesh.

Just like these teachers in Wisconsin that have called in "sick" for three days now and basically have closed down the entire state school system. "But it's for the kids!"

Oh wait...

Tyburn
02-18-2011, 08:26 PM
At that age...if he's ranting about suicide, he NEEDS help...but not from a mental institution.

He needs professional counselling, something non frightening, so that it is a non issue to him...that way the parents can keep tabs on him...but he doesnt feel like its something at all...that will make it worse, he could dwell with worry...or use it for attention seeking.

Frightening him, makes it a big thing...and big things end up permanant...so now he will never forget what happened, or the implications, he wont like school and what might have been a small issue of negativity has become some type of complex.

Their Care sounds like its only for the other students...not for the person who actually expresses the problem...what is it that the school system there runs on? some sort of Utilitarian Principle?? Whilst that solves the ethical dilema for his class mates..it actually results in his own treatment being unethical...but thats fine as far as Utilitarian Principles go.

I dont think one should be applying "the needs of the many outweight the needs of the few" on a class of 6 year olds :rolleyes:

flo
02-20-2011, 01:47 AM
What did the poor kid draw? A stick figure with a gun?

Well, I was pretty close, here's the picture, folks. What do you think?

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y117/floranista/drawing.jpg

County Mike
02-20-2011, 02:59 PM
Well, I was pretty close, here's the picture, folks. What do you think?

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y117/floranista/drawing.jpg

The only thing that bothers me about that picture is the word "Kings". If that refers to the Latin Kings, does it mean he's already interesting in the gang life? Otherwise, it's just a drawing of something he saw in a movie. (Unless, of course, he's shown a bunch of other signs as well.) The drawing alone wouldn't be enough for me to committ him.

flo
02-20-2011, 05:54 PM
The only thing that bothers me about that picture is the word "Kings". If that refers to the Latin Kings, does it mean he's already interesting in the gang life? Otherwise, it's just a drawing of something he saw in a movie. (Unless, of course, he's shown a bunch of other signs as well.) The drawing alone wouldn't be enough for me to committ him.


Mike, I wondered if that was gang-related but I had no clue about Latin Kings.

That's sad when a 6th grader is referencing gangbangers. In my day, we were more interested in kickball (and I understand that too has now been banned as being too violent, sheesh).

bradwright
02-20-2011, 08:21 PM
At that age...if he's ranting about suicide, he NEEDS help...but not from a mental institution.

He needs professional counselling, something non frightening, so that it is a non issue to him...that way the parents can keep tabs on him...but he doesnt feel like its something at all...that will make it worse, he could dwell with worry...or use it for attention seeking.

Frightening him, makes it a big thing...and big things end up permanant...so now he will never forget what happened, or the implications, he wont like school and what might have been a small issue of negativity has become some type of complex.

Their Care sounds like its only for the other students...not for the person who actually expresses the problem...what is it that the school system there runs on? some sort of Utilitarian Principle?? Whilst that solves the ethical dilema for his class mates..it actually results in his own treatment being unethical...but thats fine as far as Utilitarian Principles go.

I dont think one should be applying "the needs of the many outweight the needs of the few" on a class of 6 year olds :rolleyes:

well said and i couldn't agree more.

Tyburn
02-20-2011, 08:29 PM
well said and i couldn't agree more.

thanks :)

County Mike
02-20-2011, 08:45 PM
Well, I was pretty close, here's the picture, folks. What do you think?

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y117/floranista/drawing.jpg

He also needs to learn about scale and perception.
That gun is WAY too big for the stick figure holding it.
Enroll him in an art class.

flo
02-20-2011, 10:14 PM
He also needs to learn about scale and perception.
That gun is WAY too big for the stick figure holding it.
Enroll him in an art class.

:laugh:

Miss Foxy
02-21-2011, 02:53 PM
The only thing that bothers me about that picture is the word "Kings". If that refers to the Latin Kings, does it mean he's already interesting in the gang life? Otherwise, it's just a drawing of something he saw in a movie. (Unless, of course, he's shown a bunch of other signs as well.) The drawing alone wouldn't be enough for me to committ him.

Are Latin Kings some East coast stuff? Never heard of em here on the West Coast.

County Mike
02-21-2011, 04:44 PM
Are Latin Kings some East coast stuff? Never heard of em here on the West Coast.

Nationwide
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latin_Kings_(gang)

Miss Foxy
02-21-2011, 04:48 PM
Nationwide
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latin_Kings_(gang)

fkn punks..