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rockdawg21
09-06-2010, 04:10 PM
This might be the first good idea he's had in 595 days (http://www.widgetbox.com/widget/obama-inauguration-countdown) of being our President.

Not sure if I like the idea of removing tax breaks for oil companies to fund this. Ultimately, it will just raise the prices of gas to cover this, but if all of that money actually does go to improving our transportation infrastructure and creating jobs in the construction industry, I wouldn't have any complaints.

What do you all think?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/39023909/ns/politics-white_house
Obama to propose massive rebuilding program costing at least $50 billion
Proposals to see 150,000 miles of roads, 4,000 miles of railways, 150 miles of runways constructed or rebuilt

By JULIE PACE
http://msnbcmedia3.msn.com/j/msnbc/Components/Sources/sourceAP.standard.gif
updated 9/6/2010 7:01:03 AM ET

WASHINGTON Vowing to find new ways to stimulate the sputtering economy, President Barack Obama will call for long-term investments in the nation's roads, railways and airports that would cost at least $50 billion, administration officials said.

The infrastructure investments are one part of a package of targeted proposals the White House is expected to announce in hopes of jump-starting the economy ahead of the November election.

Obama will outline the infrastructure proposal Monday at a Labor Day event in Milwaukee.

While the proposal calls for investments over six years, officials said spending would be front-loaded with an initial $50 billion to help create jobs in the near future. The officials spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss the proposals ahead of the president's announcement.

The goals of the infrastructure plan include: rebuilding 150,000 miles of roads; constructing and maintaining 4,000 miles of railways, enough to go coast-to-coast; and rehabilitating or reconstructing 150 miles of airport runways, while also installing a new air navigation system designed to reduce travel times and delays.

Oil firms could foot bill
Obama will also call for the creation of a permanent infrastructure bank that would focus on funding national and regional infrastructure projects.

Officials wouldn't say what the total cost of the infrastructure investments would be, but did say the initial $50 billion represents a significant percentage. Officials said the White House would consider closing a number of special tax breaks for oil and gas companies to pay for the proposal.

Obama made infrastructure investments a central part of the $814 billion stimulus Congress passed last year, but with that spending winding down, the economy's growth has slowed.

Officials said this infrastructure package differs from the stimulus because it's aimed at long-term growth, while still focusing on creating jobs in the short-term.

With the unemployment rate ticking up to 9.6 percent, and polls showing the midterm elections could be dismal for Democrats, the president has promised to unveil a series of new measures on the economy.

In addition to Monday's announcement in Milwaukee, Obama will travel to Cleveland Wednesday to pitch a $100 billion proposal to increase and make permanent research and development tax credits for businesses, a White House official said.

While the idea is popular in Congress, coming up with offsetting tax increases or spending cuts has been a stumbling block.

Other stimulus measures
Similar to his proposal to pay for the infrastructure investments, Obama will ask lawmakers to close tax breaks for oil and gas companies and multinational corporations to pay for the plan.

Other stimulus measures the administration is considering include extending a law passed in March that exempts companies that hire unemployed workers from paying Social Security taxes on those workers through December.

Sen. Chuck Schumer, D-N.Y., has proposed extending the exemption an additional six months.

Obama is also continuing to prod the Senate to pass the small business bill that calls for about $12 billion in tax breaks and a $30 billion fund to help unfreeze lending.

Republicans have likened the bill to the unpopular bailout of the financial industry.

And the president wants to make permanent the portion of George W. Bush's tax cuts affecting the middle class.

Wary of the public's concern over rising deficits, the administration insists a second stimulus plan, similar to last year's $814 billion bill, is not in the works.

Copyright 2010 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

adamt
09-06-2010, 05:36 PM
this is one of the few things i could really get behind(as it is the governments job to manage infrastructure) if things weren't already screwed up and we were broke, too much like spending your paycheck on a football game, getting a loan to buy groceries then getting another loan to pay your phone bill.

imho the best answer in that situation would be to do without your phone a while, not go in further debt to have, although it is honorable, though it should have been dealt with first not last

Tyburn
09-06-2010, 07:02 PM
Why just the week before last wasnt I saying on this forum that the Americans should look into building a better train system...there is nowt wrong with Amtrak...but it needs great enhancement...its not a success to only have one line running through a major state...neither is it great when you dont have railroads through several continental states...you arent third world...but your public transport system is very poor indeed compared to anywhere in Europe.

So I am all for this...though I'm not sure the middle of a double dip depression is a good time to spend money on any large project...why couldnt he have gone for this instead of his health reform?? :rolleyes:

Oh...and dont you DARE vote for him in the mid terms based on this...if he wants your vote in time for November...he has a lot of Railways to build in the next 6 weeks doesnt he :laugh:

County Mike
09-06-2010, 09:09 PM
I'm guessing that the tax breaks being taken away from the oil companies will only apply to U.S. based oil companies. What that means is, U.S. based oil companies will have a harder time competing on the global market and the muslim oil sheiks will get an even stronger advantage.

Maybe I'm a conspiracy theorist, but this is another way for Obama to help out his muslim buddies while sticking it to America.

Play The Man
09-06-2010, 11:36 PM
Why just the week before last wasnt I saying on this forum that the Americans should look into building a better train system...there is nowt wrong with Amtrak...but it needs great enhancement...its not a success to only have one line running through a major state...neither is it great when you dont have railroads through several continental states...you arent third world...but your public transport system is very poor indeed compared to anywhere in Europe.

So I am all for this...though I'm not sure the middle of a double dip depression is a good time to spend money on any large project...why couldnt he have gone for this instead of his health reform?? :rolleyes:

Oh...and dont you DARE vote for him in the mid terms based on this...if he wants your vote in time for November...he has a lot of Railways to build in the next 6 weeks doesnt he :laugh:

Amtrak is a financial basket case. It has been subsidized with billions of tax-payer dollars since its inception. It is estimated that for every dollar it takes in, it loses two dollars. Passenger rail only makes economic sense on the east coast between major population centers. Everywhere else, it does not make economic sense.

In December 2004, the U.S. Department of Transportation published a report titled "Federal Subsidies to Passenger Transportation" providing an estimate of annual subsidies to (or profits from) different transportation modes from 1990 to 2002. According to the report, in 2002 a motorist returned a dollar to the government for every 1,000 miles driven, while buses returned $1.79 per 1,000 miles, thereby yielding the federal government a very tidy profit after taxes. Aviation passengers received a subsidy of $6.18 per 1,000 passenger miles, but this subsidy reflects reduced flights in response to Sept. 11. Prior to 2001, commercial aviation earned a profit for the government.

In contrast to the profit performance from roads and (sometimes) air, Amtrak does vastly worse: It recorded a per-passenger (per 1,000) mile subsidy of $210.31. But 2002 was not its worst year: in 1998 that subsidy reached a staggering $383.82. Ouch!

http://www.heritage.org/Research/Commentary/2006/04/If-you-want-to-play-with-trains-pick-a-cheaper-way-than-Amtrak

Tyburn
09-06-2010, 11:42 PM
Amtrak is a financial basket case. It has been subsidized with billions of tax-payer dollars since its inception. It is estimated that for every dollar it takes in, it loses two dollars. Passenger rail only makes economic sense on the east coast between major population centers. Everywhere else, it does not make economic sense.



http://www.heritage.org/Research/Commentary/2006/04/If-you-want-to-play-with-trains-pick-a-cheaper-way-than-Amtrak

It will make perfect economic sence when your cars stop working because natural resources run out. No wonder the Americans wont sign Kyoto...that CANT, if they tried to cut the carbon by slowing down private transport how on earth would anyone, get anywhere.

In this day and age in a First World Country it is unthinkable that whole States have yet to see the Railway!!! Thats unspeakably bizzare. If you had a proper Public Transport System then you wouldnt need to use your cars...but Unlike Europe...in the US you CANT do without a Car because of the enourmous space

I cant do ANY ADTs without Amtrack...not that I ever want to visit Wyoming...but if I DID then I would be extremely pissed off that there is NO WAY of getting into that State. Supposing I wanted to visit a Forum Patron...it would be like trying to crack outter mongolia!!

TexasRN
09-06-2010, 11:47 PM
It will make perfect economic sence when your cars stop working because natural resources run out. No wonder the Americans wont sign Kyoto...that CANT, if they tried to cut the carbon by slowing down private transport how on earth would anyone, get anywhere.

In this day and age in a First World Country it is unthinkable that whole States have yet to see the Railway!!! Thats unspeakably bizzare. If you had a proper Public Transport System then you wouldnt need to use your cars...but Unlike Europe...in the US you CANT do without a Car because of the enourmous space

I cant do ANY ADTs without Amtrack...not that I ever want to visit Wyoming...but if I DID then I would be extremely pissed off that there is NO WAY of getting into that State. Supposing I wanted to visit a Forum Patron...it would be like trying to crack outter mongolia!!


I am not sitting on a train or bus with weird strangers for hours on end. I'm sure I'll do the subway when I get to go to NYC in a few months but that's as far as I'm willing to go with public transportation. Ick. I want to drive MY car at MY pace and stop when and where I want to. If I can't drive then I'll fly or not go at all.


~Amy

Play The Man
09-06-2010, 11:57 PM
It will make perfect economic sence when your cars stop working because natural resources run out. No wonder the Americans wont sign Kyoto...that CANT, if they tried to cut the carbon by slowing down private transport how on earth would anyone, get anywhere.

In this day and age in a First World Country it is unthinkable that whole States have yet to see the Railway!!! Thats unspeakably bizzare. If you had a proper Public Transport System then you wouldnt need to use your cars...but Unlike Europe...in the US you CANT do without a Car because of the enourmous space

I cant do ANY ADTs without Amtrack...not that I ever want to visit Wyoming...but if I DID then I would be extremely pissed off that there is NO WAY of getting into that State. Supposing I wanted to visit a Forum Patron...it would be like trying to crack outter mongolia!!

You should rent a car. You could probably rent a car for a week for $200-$300 with unlimited mileage. If you drove a small, fuel-efficient car, the gas bill wouldn't be that large. You could go wherever you wanted to, on your own schedule. That is the beauty of freedom and choices.

You mentioned Wyoming. Once, I drove all night from Sinclair, Wyoming to Yellowstone National Park. I have to admit that I almost wrecked when I came across a herd of antelope in the middle of a gravel road at about 3 A.M! I arrived at Yellowstone just as the sun was rising. It is one of my favorite memories.

Tyburn
09-06-2010, 11:59 PM
I am not sitting on a train or bus with weird strangers for hours on end. I'm sure I'll do the subway when I get to go to NYC in a few months but that's as far as I'm willing to go with public transportation. Ick. I want to drive MY car at MY pace and stop when and where I want to. If I can't drive then I'll fly or not go at all.


~Amy

Whats wrong with public transport? Communicable Diseases will get you wherever you are...I mean, you might avoid catching the Winter Sickness bug from someone on the bus...but unless you work from home or from your car...I guess you have to get out and work with a group of people in the same environment no matter who you are.

I work in a store...thousands of people walk through it every single day...in close proximity...THAT is Ick :laugh:

Tyburn
09-07-2010, 12:00 AM
You should rent a car. You could probably rent a car for a week for $200-$300 with unlimited mileage. If you drove a small, fuel-efficient car, the gas bill wouldn't be that large. You could go wherever you wanted to, on your own schedule. That is the beauty of freedom and choices.

You mentioned Wyoming. Once, I drove all night from Sinclair, Wyoming to Yellowstone National Park. I have to admit that I almost wrecked when I came across a herd of antelope in the middle of a gravel road at about 3 A.M! I arrived at Yellowstone just as the sun was rising. It is one of my favorite memories.

I cant Drive :sad:

Play The Man
09-07-2010, 12:00 AM
I am not sitting on a train or bus with weird strangers for hours on end. I'm sure I'll do the subway when I get to go to NYC in a few months but that's as far as I'm willing to go with public transportation. Ick. I want to drive MY car at MY pace and stop when and where I want to. If I can't drive then I'll fly or not go at all.


~Amy

That is probably my biggest beef with public transportation - all the weirdos!:wacko: I would rather sit in my own car, listening to the radio, with comfortable air conditioning.

Tyburn
09-07-2010, 12:02 AM
That is probably my biggest beef with public transportation - all the weirdos!:wacko: I would rather sit in my own car, listening to the radio, with comfortable air conditioning.

Oh I love public Transport.

Its like a little community, the same people, going to the same destination each day...they all know each other, all the seniors, and they talk to one another, and they share tales...its fantastic

maybe im one of those weirdos :unsure::laugh:

Play The Man
09-07-2010, 12:06 AM
I cant Drive :sad:

What?!?!:blink:

No excuses, Tyburn. How much time until your next American Dreams Tour? You need to take Driver's Education, get a license, and research what you would need to rent a car in the U.S. Road trips are a blast! It would open up the world to you like nothing else. You simply must do it.

Play The Man
09-07-2010, 12:09 AM
Oh I love public Transport.

Its like a little community, the same people, going to the same destination each day...they all know each other, all the seniors, and they talk to one another, and they share tales...its fantastic

maybe im one of those weirdos :unsure::laugh:

Haven't you seen the YouTube video with "Epic Beard Guy" and "Amber Lamps"? Unfortunately, that is the typical clientele for much of public transportation in the U.S.

TexasRN
09-07-2010, 12:10 AM
Whats wrong with public transport? Communicable Diseases will get you wherever you are...I mean, you might avoid catching the Winter Sickness bug from someone on the bus...but unless you work from home or from your car...I guess you have to get out and work with a group of people in the same environment no matter who you are.

I work in a store...thousands of people walk through it every single day...in close proximity...THAT is Ick :laugh:


I'm a nurse. I am exposed to EVERYthing all the time. That doesn't bother me, it just makes my immune system stronger.

I don't like to be forced to be around other people that I don't know. I don't like large groups of people. I can't even stand to ride the elevator at work with other people.


~Amy

Tyburn
09-07-2010, 11:48 AM
What?!?!:blink:

No excuses, Tyburn. How much time until your next American Dreams Tour? You need to take Driver's Education, get a license, and research what you would need to rent a car in the U.S. Road trips are a blast! It would open up the world to you like nothing else. You simply must do it.

Well...I can drive..I just couldnt pass a test :laugh: I've never heard of "Drivers Education" but in England Driving Lessons cost an absolute fortune. :sad:

NateR
09-07-2010, 12:43 PM
This might be the first good idea he's had in 595 days (http://www.widgetbox.com/widget/obama-inauguration-countdown) of being our President.

Not sure if I like the idea of removing tax breaks for oil companies to fund this. Ultimately, it will just raise the prices of gas to cover this, but if all of that money actually does go to improving our transportation infrastructure and creating jobs in the construction industry, I wouldn't have any complaints.

What do you all think?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/39023909/ns/politics-white_house

If he had proposed this BEFORE the stimulus bill and healthcare, then I would have supported it. As of right now, we just don't have the money to spend.

This really just comes off as a desperate ploy to try to win some favor with voters for the Democrat candidates in November.

J.B.
09-07-2010, 02:43 PM
Haven't you seen the YouTube video with "Epic Beard Guy" and "Amber Lamps"? Unfortunately, that is the typical clientele for much of public transportation in the U.S.

To be fair...that video happened in Oakland.

Play The Man
09-07-2010, 07:55 PM
Well...I can drive..I just couldnt pass a test :laugh: I've never heard of "Drivers Education" but in England Driving Lessons cost an absolute fortune. :sad:

Drivers' Education was part of the curriculum in high school. When you turned 15 years old, you were eligible to get a learner's permit. You took a course with classroom instruction as well as instruction time in a car with 2 sets of brakes - one for the student and one for the instructor. On your 16th birthday, you went in to take the test and get your license.

flo
09-07-2010, 07:59 PM
Haven't you seen the YouTube video with "Epic Beard Guy" and "Amber Lamps"? Unfortunately, that is the typical clientele for much of public transportation in the U.S.

And that was a FUN incident.

:ninja:

flo
09-07-2010, 08:06 PM
Like Amy, I can't take crowds or close proximity to strangers.

My last bus ride: In Seattle, many years ago with my younger sister, both of us 20-something white girls. The black guy behind us leans forward and says "Excuse me, miss?", we both turn around, smile and say "yes?" and he asks "Do you have any human waste I can eat?".

I immediately got up and went about 5 rows ahead and sat next to a stranger. I thought he was going to ask us what time it was. It was also extra creepy as he asked it in a pleasant, cultured voice.

:scared0015:

flo
09-07-2010, 08:08 PM
I had a brother and 2 sisters living in Seattle at that time. I was the country hick; they said I was a weirdo magnet as stuff like that never happened to them except when I'd come to visit.

I try to avoid large, urban areas altogether.

rearnakedchoke
09-07-2010, 08:11 PM
sounds like a lot of money, but infrastrucure is important and requires lots of money and planning for it to be right ...but proper roads and rail are best built before they are needed ... sounds like obama knows what he is talking about as usual ...

Miss Foxy
09-07-2010, 08:11 PM
Pretty much on public transportation all I have seen are weirdos.. I can't handle the germs, looks, and fear of something bad..:unsure-1::ninja: I need to suck it up.. I am going to invest in a gas mask!! lol..

Tyburn
09-07-2010, 08:24 PM
Drivers' Education was part of the curriculum in high school. When you turned 15 years old, you were eligible to get a learner's permit. You took a course with classroom instruction as well as instruction time in a car with 2 sets of brakes - one for the student and one for the instructor. On your 16th birthday, you went in to take the test and get your license.

What?? The United States has Driving Courses on their National Cirriculum of Education???

That NEVER happens in England. Here there is Driving Schools, and once of age, marked at Seventeen Years. You may apply for a provisional Liscence, this involves paying for it. Once you have it you can begin Driving lessons with an Instructor with duel manuel controls. Practise in a car outside of lessons can not happen unaccompanied, and I believe you have to get special insurance even if you practise of road.

Once you have done enough Driving Lessons, which are generally booked in hour sessions and horrendously expensive, You must book and pass a theory test, which is done now on a computer, to test you on The High Way Code...WARNING, this theory test is dated...it goes out of date...so you must pass your driving practical test before it expires...or else you have to re-take even if you passed. (I passed my theory...and then failed the test...so long ago, I'd now have to do the theory all over again) obviously you pay for the theory, and for the practical...and if you pass, you have to pay for your provisional liscence to be re-jiged into a full liscence, from whence you may drive a car alone...after you have bought it, inssureed it, made it road worthy by passing a mechanical test (MOT, which happens each year) and of course paid your road tax. Each of which cost a fortune...then of course you must keep funnelling money into the rising cost of petrol.

If you pass in a Manual...you may drive manual or automatic...if you pass in an automatic...you would have to do another test to convert that into manual if you ever wanted to drive one. Motor Bikes can be driven forever on a provisional liscence, and you may drive alone...dont ask me how or why. If you want to drive anything other then a car, you must take other tests, for bus, or heavy good, or construction/farming equipment...each needs its own insurance, tax and a valid MOT

I started driving and was learning in a diesel engine for around a year, but could only afford a maximum of two sessions per week, and I learned in Lincoln, a relatively Rural city. But it was good enough for me to pass the theory. Then we relocated to Harrogate, so I had to go in a different car, in a tiny spa town with parked cars on both sides of flipping one way streets...it was like a wing mirror tunnel! then I went to University, so I had to swap a third time, This time it was full on urban city with the Muslim guys who'd just love to go kamakazie right infront of me...I had an extremely good emergency stop, thank GOD! this time I was in a petrol engine by then, and we were doing quite well because I naughtily used my student loan..I didnt know if I was quite ready, but the time was ticking on my Theory, so we went for it...and epically failed :laugh: It didnt help when the foolish test guy didnt really communicate in English.

We pulled out of the test centre and right away things went quite bad. He told me to take the next left...I asked him if he was certain he wanted me to do that. He got upperty...so I took the next left into the ajacent car park...and he wails "not that left" causing me to stall out in the middle of bloody on coming traffic. So after turning round we were off...right towards Five Lane Ends Round-a-bout...I dont like round-a-bouts, and was concentrating so much on making sure I was in the right lane, I couldnt remember which turning he wanted me to take...and before I knew it we were on the round-a-bout itself...so we went round once, then again, whilst I tried in vein to recall his instructions...by the third time round, I just knew I had to select a road...and blow me...I went in the opposite direction.

But what he decided to fail me on was not using my handbreak when coming down a hill onto a main road, and waiting to turn right across the traffic...it might not have helpped that I decided to go and then changed my mind several times, before I actually pulled out...holding the car at biting point, and obviously inching forward everytime I was just about ready to go...and then...changing my mind

:)

After that I didnt do anymore driving lessons, and then left for London where I didnt need one, and then back to Harrogate where I dont need one.

The only thing to do with transport that IS provided in the British Education System is something called "Cycling proficiency" incase you're wondering...I failed that test twice...and then decided I'd stick to cycling on the pavement, which, is technically speaking, not legal unless its a cycle path...but I soon gave up on cycling all together after that...I have legs. If I want to go somewhere, I walk...if I want to go far, I use public transport, and congratulate myself on doing my bit to save the environment.

IF I did ever take up driving again, I'd go for Automatic...because what confused me most about driving was having to change gear every two blinking seconds...I mean for heavens sake! If I didnt have enough to concentrate without fiddling around with a cruddy gear stick...and then...obviously forgetting what gear I was in

"Time to go to third?"

"Dave, we're on a duel carrigeway, you are already IN third"

:no:

County Mike
09-07-2010, 08:54 PM
So nobody agrees with me that it might just be a way to give foreign oil companies a bigger advantage over American/British oil companies?

Tyburn
09-07-2010, 08:57 PM
So nobody agrees with me that it might just be a way to give foreign oil companies a bigger advantage over American/British oil companies?

in a word.

No

This isnt a contriversy...this is a false promise, backed up without capitol, in order to win support from gullible Americans in time for Mid-Terms :)

rearnakedchoke
09-07-2010, 09:47 PM
So nobody agrees with me that it might just be a way to give foreign oil companies a bigger advantage over American/British oil companies?

we thought you were joking ... like when you said this person should be the next president ..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xUPKKbmWMZ8

County Mike
09-07-2010, 10:37 PM
So she stumbled over her words. I'd rather have a patriotic American who stumbles than a smooth talking, anti-American any day.

rearnakedchoke
09-07-2010, 10:38 PM
So she stumbled over her words. I'd rather have a patriotic American who stumbles than a smooth talking, anti-American any day.

i am just saying bro .. i would love for her to run ... imagine those presidential debates ...

adamt
09-07-2010, 11:07 PM
let's see, someone who can think for themselves and use real words, albeit not as smooth as some politicians, yet still smoother than any of us could on that platform,

or someone that can't even talk without a teleprompter in front of them

NateR
09-07-2010, 11:08 PM
sounds like a lot of money, but infrastrucure is important and requires lots of money and planning for it to be right ...but proper roads and rail are best built before they are needed ... sounds like obama knows what he is talking about as usual ...

lol, no. :laugh: It's called "stating the obvious." Obama is just telling us all information we already know. It's like me saying, "If you don't eat food everyday, you will starve." Everybody already knows that, so it doesn't make me an expert on nutrition.

NateR
09-07-2010, 11:10 PM
let's see, someone who can think for themselves and use real words, albeit not as smooth as some politicians, yet still smoother than any of us could on that platform,

or someone that can't even talk without a teleprompter in front of them

I guess some people think that we should only elect intellectual elitists, who charm us with their words and personality, to public office. After all, look how well that worked out for Nazi Germany.

Tyburn
09-07-2010, 11:30 PM
I guess some people think that we should only elect intellectual elitists, who charm us with their words and personality, to public office. After all, look how well that worked out for Nazi Germany.

:blink: Adolf was no "Intellectual Elitist" he was actually more arts/crafts...He used to paint before the wars.

But your right about the public speaking bit...What Adolf provided the population with was hope, right when they thought they were in an unwinnable situation.

But he inspired a level of Patriotism I have NEVER seen coming from Barack Obama...infact Barack is not nearly as Patriotic as most Americans if what he says is anything to go by...He bearly speaks about unity...let alone anything specifically American...Thats part of why he doesnt fit in, for the U.S he is too close to the Left for the culture...this makes his words hollow now that the facade has gone...Hitler was different...His words, right up to the liberation of Berlin, were listened to, because he was able to lie by creating a patriotic dream of what the country could be. People were so taken up in rebuilding their once proud nation, to newer heights, they overlooked his failing.

I'm not sure that Obama is seen as a beacon of hope even in the Democratic party. I'm not sure they would be able to buy into his myth...largely its because he has no cover for his lack of substance. This cover allowed Hitler to do all sorts of things, from mass murder..to removing the very instrument that got him into power when it looked like that gave them powers he didnt want them to have...meanwhile, When Obama makes mistakes, like not dealing quickly enough with the BP oil crisis, or forcing through an unpopular reform...so unpopular that even with a significant majority its not obvious he could succeed before the actual vote...

I dont think he provides enough reassurance...he doesnt invoke the powers avilable to him. Why he doesnt...I dont know. It may be an issue of race, it may be an issue of faith...it could be simply that he would consider such things to nationalistic. I dont know.

His rise, in terms of elloquence IS very similar to Adolf (without the practical...Adolf actually stood and pickett lines and got involved with political rebellions...Dear Barack Obama is head of a Military without ever having been a soldier... :laugh: But thats where the comparison ends

NateR
09-07-2010, 11:47 PM
:blink: Adolf was no "Intellectual Elitist" he was actually more arts/crafts...He used to paint before the wars.

But your right about the public speaking bit...What Adolf provided the population with was hope, right when they thought they were in an unwinnable situation.

But he inspired a level of Patriotism I have NEVER seen coming from Barack Obama...infact Barack is not nearly as Patriotic as most Americans if what he says is anything to go by...He bearly speaks about unity...let alone anything specifically American...Thats part of why he doesnt fit in, for the U.S he is too close to the Left for the culture...this makes his words hollow now that the facade has gone...Hitler was different...His words, right up to the liberation of Berlin, were listened to, because he was able to lie by creating a patriotic dream of what the country could be. People were so taken up in rebuilding their once proud nation, to newer heights, they overlooked his failing.

I'm not sure that Obama is seen as a beacon of hope even in the Democratic party. I'm not sure they would be able to buy into his myth...largely its because he has no cover for his lack of substance. This cover allowed Hitler to do all sorts of things, from mass murder..to removing the very instrument that got him into power when it looked like that gave them powers he didnt want them to have...meanwhile, When Obama makes mistakes, like not dealing quickly enough with the BP oil crisis, or forcing through an unpopular reform...so unpopular that even with a significant majority its not obvious he could succeed before the actual vote...

I dont think he provides enough reassurance...he doesnt invoke the powers avilable to him. Why he doesnt...I dont know. It may be an issue of race, it may be an issue of faith...it could be simply that he would consider such things to nationalistic. I dont know.

His rise, in terms of elloquence IS very similar to Adolf (without the practical...Adolf actually stood and pickett lines and got involved with political rebellions...Dear Barack Obama is head of a Military without ever having been a soldier... :laugh: But thats where the comparison ends

I was referring to the Nazi leadership in general with the intellectual elitist comment. All of those brilliant men and experts with their Master's degrees and doctorates deciding who should live and who should die. Of course, they weren't elected to office, but it should still stand as a warning to the dangers of trusting those kinds of people to lead nations.

Despite her stumblings on camera, I know that Sarah Palin's heart is in the right place. Obama... I'm not even really sure if he has one. :laugh:

Tyburn
09-08-2010, 12:11 AM
I was referring to the Nazi leadership in general with the intellectual elitist comment. All of those brilliant men and experts with their Master's degrees and doctorates deciding who should live and who should die. Of course, they weren't elected to office, but it should still stand as a warning to the dangers of trusting those kinds of people to lead nations.

Despite her stumblings on camera, I know that Sarah Palin's heart is in the right place. Obama... I'm not even really sure if he has one. :laugh:

I dont know how much of it was the Leadership...and how much of it was actually the scientists who worked under them. Germany was pretty advanced, Eugenics, and weaponary development also.

County Mike
09-08-2010, 11:26 AM
Jan Brewer could stumble and stutter at every debate and I'd STILL vote for her because she has the United States best interest in mind. She won't bow down and cater to our enemies.

Tyburn
09-08-2010, 11:33 AM
Jan Brewer could stumble and stutter at every debate and I'd STILL vote for her because she has the United States best interest in mind. She won't bow down and cater to our enemies.

At the end of the day...if she is qualified...what difference does her ability to speak make? One of the best Prime ministers we had was Winston Churchill who muttered and mumbled so much he was bearly audable :laugh:

The best people for the job will never run, because they wouldnt want to do it, because they truely understand what its all about. :sad:

CAVEMAN
09-10-2010, 03:15 PM
This is just another bad plan! Rebuilding and rehabing roads and rails does not create long term jobs. Once it's over, people are unemployed again!