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rockdawg21
08-25-2010, 08:16 PM
Talk about Big Brother.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/time/08599201315000;_ylt=AtMeIzBdGvGBuH1TCCATVR.s0NUE;_ ylu=X3oDMTNrdXBzc3VqBGFzc2V0A3RpbWUvMjAxMDA4MjUvMD g1OTkyMDEzMTUwMDAEY2NvZGUDbW9zdHBvcHVsYXIEY3BvcwM4 BHBvcwM1BHB0A2hvbWVfY29rZQRzZWMDeW5faGVhZGxpbmVfbG lzdARzbGsDdGhlZ292ZXJubWVu
The Government's New Right to Track Your Every Move With GPS

http://l.yimg.com/a/i/us/nws/p/time_logo_101.jpg

By ADAM COHEN Adam Cohen 1 hr 3 mins ago

Government agents can sneak onto your property in the middle of the night, put a GPS device on the bottom of your car and keep track of everywhere you go. This doesn't violate your Fourth Amendment rights, because you do not have any reasonable expectation of privacy in your own driveway - and no reasonable expectation that the government isn't tracking your movements.

That is the bizarre - and scary - rule that now applies in California and eight other Western states. The U.S. Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit, which covers this vast jurisdiction, recently decided the government can monitor you in this way virtually anytime it wants - with no need for a search warrant. (See a TIME photoessay on Cannabis Culture.)

It is a dangerous decision - one that, as the dissenting judges warned, could turn America into the sort of totalitarian state imagined by George Orwell. It is particularly offensive because the judges added insult to injury with some shocking class bias: the little personal privacy that still exists, the court suggested, should belong mainly to the rich.

This case began in 2007, when Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA) agents decided to monitor Juan Pineda-Moreno, an Oregon resident who they suspected was growing marijuana. They snuck onto his property in the middle of the night and found his Jeep in his driveway, a few feet from his trailer home. Then they attached a GPS tracking device to the vehicle's underside.

After Pineda-Moreno challenged the DEA's actions, a three-judge panel of the Ninth Circuit ruled in January that it was all perfectly legal. More disturbingly, a larger group of judges on the circuit, who were subsequently asked to reconsider the ruling, decided this month to let it stand. (Pineda-Moreno has pleaded guilty conditionally to conspiracy to manufacture marijuana and manufacturing marijuana while appealing the denial of his motion to suppress evidence obtained with the help of GPS.)

In fact, the government violated Pineda-Moreno's privacy rights in two different ways. For starters, the invasion of his driveway was wrong. The courts have long held that people have a reasonable expectation of privacy in their homes and in the "curtilage," a fancy legal term for the area around the home. The government's intrusion on property just a few feet away was clearly in this zone of privacy.

The judges veered into offensiveness when they explained why Pineda-Moreno's driveway was not private. It was open to strangers, they said, such as delivery people and neighborhood children, who could wander across it uninvited. (See the misadventures of the CIA.)

Chief Judge Alex Kozinski, who dissented from this month's decision refusing to reconsider the case, pointed out whose homes are not open to strangers: rich people's. The court's ruling, he said, means that people who protect their homes with electric gates, fences and security booths have a large protected zone of privacy around their homes. People who cannot afford such barriers have to put up with the government sneaking around at night.

Judge Kozinski is a leading conservative, appointed by President Ronald Reagan, but in his dissent he came across as a raging liberal. "There's been much talk about diversity on the bench, but there's one kind of diversity that doesn't exist," he wrote. "No truly poor people are appointed as federal judges, or as state judges for that matter." The judges in the majority, he charged, were guilty of "cultural elitism." (Read about one man's efforts to escape the surveillance state.)

The court went on to make a second terrible decision about privacy: that once a GPS device has been planted, the government is free to use it to track people without getting a warrant. There is a major battle under way in the federal and state courts over this issue, and the stakes are high. After all, if government agents can track people with secretly planted GPS devices virtually anytime they want, without having to go to a court for a warrant, we are one step closer to a classic police state - with technology taking on the role of the KGB or the East German Stasi.

Fortunately, other courts are coming to a different conclusion from the Ninth Circuit's - including the influential U.S. Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit. That court ruled, also this month, that tracking for an extended period of time with GPS is an invasion of privacy that requires a warrant. The issue is likely to end up in the Supreme Court.

In these highly partisan times, GPS monitoring is a subject that has both conservatives and liberals worried. The U.S. Court of Appeals for the D.C. Circuit's pro-privacy ruling was unanimous - decided by judges appointed by Presidents Ronald Reagan, George W. Bush and Bill Clinton. (Comment on this story.)

Plenty of liberals have objected to this kind of spying, but it is the conservative Chief Judge Kozinski who has done so most passionately. "1984 may have come a bit later than predicted, but it's here at last," he lamented in his dissent. And invoking Orwell's totalitarian dystopia where privacy is essentially nonexistent, he warned: "Some day, soon, we may wake up and find we're living in Oceania."

Cohen, a lawyer, is a former TIME writer and a former member of the New York Times editorial board.

BamaGrits84
08-25-2010, 10:11 PM
Wonder if I could get them to track someone for me.... :ninja:

J.B.
08-25-2010, 10:32 PM
http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTTrzJr8NSSeF4tAOTGa17VZRhxY8ttY CpV-BdcYznspJMR0yE&t=1&usg=__m0gvNo_ZU-7DHxALBQIyOqYW2YQ=

matthughesfan21
08-26-2010, 12:24 AM
I think its somewhat BS, but it's not invading our privacy much more than in the past.

adamt
08-26-2010, 12:56 AM
so if the government can do it, then i should be able to do it to my neighbors too huh?


and i figure they;'re already tracking anyone they want by cell phone anyways

matthughesfan21
08-26-2010, 01:19 AM
and i figure they;'re already tracking anyone they want by cell phone anyways
cell phone, email, landline, credit card purchases, medical and financial records, etc.

This GPS thing sucks, but 2001, the Govt. has had the ability to do these things....Knowing when I drive to walmart isn't anymore of an invasion of privacy than possibly listening or reading every phone call, email, and text

Neezar
08-26-2010, 12:15 PM
Wonder if I could get them to track someone for me.... :ninja:

You can do it yourself. And most likely can find a way to do it legally. :unsure-1:

If you want to know how you can pm me. However, most people that track someone else TRULY wished later that they hadn't.

rearnakedchoke
08-26-2010, 01:44 PM
for a second there i thought the government was gonna use this to track people ...

http://img.thesun.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00407/gsp_280x390_407499a.jpg

VCURamFan
08-26-2010, 05:05 PM
for a second there i thought the government was gonna use this to track people ...

http://img.thesun.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00407/gsp_280x390_407499a.jpgNo, the government's going to use MHR to track him! :laugh:

Tyburn
08-26-2010, 06:11 PM
They could. But they wont. That would probably turn out to be on the whole pointless, and very expensive:laugh: besides, with the CCTVs they have all over cities these days, they can track you through cameras I would have thought if they were that concerned.

I think Governments do deeply care what their citizens DO...but no always where they go. So...going to the shops isnt the issue, but what you spend, at what shops...thats useful for them to know...that isnt anything they can find out even with a GPS on your person.

But they can do it through the banks and CCTV :ninja: I suspect they already do with people they are interested in. Chances are you'd have to pop up on some bizzare radar before they care enough to bother...perhaps you type in a naughty word into google...or perhaps you view some odd videos on youtube (hopefully mine arent classified as odd) :laugh:

In England...I'm sure the Government knows everything about me...the problem is, they dont talk to each other...so they have all this information...but they keep troubling me with questions, because its a breach of confidentiality to receive the answers to the same questions I gave another branch of the Government.

Form filling really pisses me off. :angry:

:laugh:

Twinsmama
08-26-2010, 07:00 PM
You can do it yourself. And most likely can find a way to do it legally. :unsure-1:

If you want to know how you can pm me. However, most people that track someone else TRULY wished later that they hadn't.

Ummm me and you are friends right?:laugh: Not sure I want to be on your bad side:laugh:

It's sad but true. My sister in law put something in her computer to see what her husband was doing when she was at work..... i will say if you are going to be crazy and do that at least have the guts to make a move when you find out what you had suspected all along.....

oops sorry back on track....the gps thing is weird. i'm sure they can track you anyway though.

Neezar
08-26-2010, 07:09 PM
Ummm me and you are friends right?:laugh: Not sure I want to be on your bad side:laugh:

It's sad but true. My sister in law put something in her computer to see what her husband was doing when she was at work..... i will say if you are going to be crazy and do that at least have the guts to make a move when you find out what you had suspected all along.....

oops sorry back on track....the gps thing is weird. i'm sure they can track you anyway though.

Yes, we are friends. :laugh: Not to worry. I got out of that business years ago. :ninja: And I am mostly an "I don't want to know" type person. lol. I don't really care what you do as long as you cut the lawn, fix stuff, hang my pics where I want them, take me where I want to go, and make me sammichs. :laugh: