PDA

View Full Version : Children! From Charlie Daniels soapbox!


KENTUCKYREDBONE
01-23-2010, 04:22 PM
2009 Soap Box Archives


Children

I love children. I love their innocence, their openness and their wide-eyed wonder.

Recently on a trip to Hong Kong we visited an orphanage and found ourselves in the company of a dozen or so four to six-years-olds who didn't speak English and had never seen us before in their young lives.

They were just a tad standoffish to start with, but before long Hazel and myself had a lap full of rowdy, laughing Chinese kids and the only language we really needed were the smiles on our faces and the feeling in our hearts.

They were so precious and the only problem with our visiting them was that when we left we wanted to take them all with us.

A child can melt my heart in a second and I cannot bear the thought of them being mistreated. To me the worst crime anybody can commit is to harm a little child.

Even though they are the most defenseless of our citizens they are among the most under represented, unable to defend themselves against drug crazed parents, irresponsible judges, politicians who refuse to pass laws with teeth in them and society's lowest form of scum, child molesters.

To me the penalty for raping an infant or a small child should be a death sentence, plain and simple. We can't even imagine the pain a baby feels when some perverted monster violates their innocent bodies.

What worse crime can there be? And yet there are judges who turn serial child rapists back on to the street in amazingly short amounts of time. These judges have no more business on the bench of justice than a department store dummy.

There is something about pedophilia that makes it practically incurable.

Have you ever heard of an organization called NAMBLA? That's an acronym for the North American Man Boy Love Association, and their only reason for existing is for full-grown pedophiles to prey on young boys, and believe it or not, Kevin Jennings, the White House's "Safe Schools Czar," has said that he has always been "inspired" by NAMBLA founder, Harry Hay.

Yes folks, they are all around us stalking innocent children and the suffering they cause is catastrophic, they ruin and many times take young lives, they destroy families and wreak havoc on the human beings that have no defense against them.

They've got to be taken off the streets.

Years ago there was a horrible case of two boys in North Carolina raping and killing a very young girl.

She was begging for her mother as they molested her and when they were done they took a stick and rammed her panties down her throat until she suffocated. It took five minutes for her to die.

The prosecutor got a conviction and asked for the death penalty. In ending his summation, he told the jury that there would be a silent period of five minutes. During which he told them to try to hold their breath.

I think that anybody who doesn't agree that pedophiles are the worst of criminals should try to hold their breath for five minutes and then go out and insert a fence post in their rectums.

Protect our children, whatever it takes. Judges and politicians be damned.

What do you think?

Pray for our troops, and for our country.

God Bless America.

Charlie Daniels











ęCopyright The Charlie Daniels Band

Mac
01-23-2010, 04:42 PM
2009 Soap Box Archives


Children

I love children. I love their innocence, their openness and their wide-eyed wonder.

Recently on a trip to Hong Kong we visited an orphanage and found ourselves in the company of a dozen or so four to six-years-olds who didn't speak English and had never seen us before in their young lives.

They were just a tad standoffish to start with, but before long Hazel and myself had a lap full of rowdy, laughing Chinese kids and the only language we really needed were the smiles on our faces and the feeling in our hearts.

They were so precious and the only problem with our visiting them was that when we left we wanted to take them all with us.

A child can melt my heart in a second and I cannot bear the thought of them being mistreated. To me the worst crime anybody can commit is to harm a little child.

Even though they are the most defenseless of our citizens they are among the most under represented, unable to defend themselves against drug crazed parents, irresponsible judges, politicians who refuse to pass laws with teeth in them and society's lowest form of scum, child molesters.

To me the penalty for raping an infant or a small child should be a death sentence, plain and simple. We can't even imagine the pain a baby feels when some perverted monster violates their innocent bodies.

What worse crime can there be? And yet there are judges who turn serial child rapists back on to the street in amazingly short amounts of time. These judges have no more business on the bench of justice than a department store dummy.

There is something about pedophilia that makes it practically incurable.

Have you ever heard of an organization called NAMBLA? That's an acronym for the North American Man Boy Love Association, and their only reason for existing is for full-grown pedophiles to prey on young boys, and believe it or not, Kevin Jennings, the White House's "Safe Schools Czar," has said that he has always been "inspired" by NAMBLA founder, Harry Hay.

Yes folks, they are all around us stalking innocent children and the suffering they cause is catastrophic, they ruin and many times take young lives, they destroy families and wreak havoc on the human beings that have no defense against them.

They've got to be taken off the streets.

Years ago there was a horrible case of two boys in North Carolina raping and killing a very young girl.

She was begging for her mother as they molested her and when they were done they took a stick and rammed her panties down her throat until she suffocated. It took five minutes for her to die.

The prosecutor got a conviction and asked for the death penalty. In ending his summation, he told the jury that there would be a silent period of five minutes. During which he told them to try to hold their breath.

I think that anybody who doesn't agree that pedophiles are the worst of criminals should try to hold their breath for five minutes and then go out and insert a fence post in their rectums.

Protect our children, whatever it takes. Judges and politicians be damned.

What do you think?

Pray for our troops, and for our country.

God Bless America.

Charlie Daniels











ęCopyright The Charlie Daniels Band



No rational thinking human being can argue with that. i feel 100% the same .


Only thing i would change , and this has always been my thought, Is that before they are shot , they need to be tied up naked and thier pants dropped . Then they need to be bent over a table or fence , take a rag that has been rubbed on a mare thats in heat and rub them down with it , then cut loose a big stud horse and let him have his way with them , just so they know the pain and suffering and helpless ness that they caused thier victims to feel , and if that doesnt kill them , Then shoot em .

Mark
01-23-2010, 05:05 PM
Death by Unga Bunga!

NateR
01-23-2010, 06:20 PM
After the gays get the right to force their lifestyle into everyone's face, the pedophiles are waiting in the wings to fight for their "rights" as well.

So stopping groups like NAMBLA starts with stopping the Gay Rights movement. Because once our country gets to the point where we fully accept the openly gay lifestyle, then there is no limits to the depravity we as a nation will sink to.

KENTUCKYREDBONE
01-23-2010, 06:21 PM
After the gays get the right to force their lifestyle into everyone's face, the pedophiles are waiting in the wings to fight for their "rights" as well.

So stopping groups like NAMBLA starts with stopping the Gay Rights movement. Because once our country gets to the point where we fully accept the openly gay lifestyle, then there is no limits to the depravity we as a nation will sink to.

Thats kinda my thoughts as well!

bradwright
01-23-2010, 06:42 PM
After the gays get the right to force their lifestyle into everyone's face, the pedophiles are waiting in the wings to fight for their "rights" as well.
So stopping groups like NAMBLA starts with stopping the Gay Rights movement. Because once our country gets to the point where we fully accept the openly gay lifestyle, then there is no limits to the depravity we as a nation will sink to.

so you are saying that being Gay and being a pedophile are the same sort of thing nate ? :unsure-1:

VCURamFan
01-23-2010, 06:48 PM
so you are saying that being Gay and being a pedophile are the same sort of thing nate ? :unsure-1:
If by "the same sort of thing" you mean "sin", then I'd say, yes. That means they're also the "the same sort of thing" as worshipping any diety other than God, worshipping idols, using vulgar language, disrespecting one's parents, not honoring the sabbath, murder, lust, stealing, lying & envy.

bradwright
01-23-2010, 06:54 PM
If by "the same sort of thing" you mean "sin", then I'd say, yes. That means they're also the "the same sort of thing" as worshipping any diety other than God, worshipping idols, using vulgar language, disrespecting one's parents, not honoring the sabbath, murder, lust, stealing, lying & envy.

so you are saying its a sin to be Gay then ?

Neezar
01-23-2010, 07:01 PM
so you are saying its a sin to be Gay then ?

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii269/theogrit/Large%20Smilies/1lg035faint.gif

Neezar
01-23-2010, 07:06 PM
so you are saying that being Gay and being a pedophile are the same sort of thing nate ? :unsure-1:


Brad, just curious here. Are you familiar with the arguments that NAMBLA uses to justify and/or defend their actions?

NateR
01-23-2010, 07:15 PM
so you are saying that being Gay and being a pedophile are the same sort of thing nate ? :unsure-1:

Child molestation, homosexual acts, fornication (sex before marriage), adultery, bestiality, pornography, etc. all fall under the larger category of immorality. So yes, they are all related.

What makes the NAMBLA movement similar to the Gay Rights movement is that they are using the same arguments. So, once people accept this false notion that gay people are normal and "God made them that way" then it's a very small logical leap to apply that same idea to pedophiles. All the pedophiles have to do is find a way to claim that the sex is "consensual."

NateR
01-23-2010, 07:19 PM
so you are saying its a sin to be Gay then ?

I have to clarify. Homosexual acts are a sin, which includes lust because that requires active imagining of a sexual act (but lust would be a sin for anyone, gay or straight). Homosexuality itself is just a mental illness which can lead to sin if not controlled or cured.

bradwright
01-23-2010, 07:49 PM
Brad, just curious here. Are you familiar with the arguments that NAMBLA uses to justify and/or defend their actions?

i'm not talking about pedophiles.....i'm asking about Gays...in my eyes there is a huge difference between the two.
i will use myself as an example...when i was in my early teenage years i was attracted to young teenage girls but as i got older the age of the girls i was attracted to increased as well and then one day when i was about 25 or so i started to see girls younger then about 20 as being to young and found i wasn't attracted to them anymore.

A pedophile on the other hand is only attracted to children so although a grown man is attracted to young girls and i am attracted to women around my own age doesn't make the two of us the same.

so in my eyes 2 adults that are the same sex and are attracted to each other cant compare to an adult male that is attracted to young boys.

Neezar
01-23-2010, 08:31 PM
i'm not talking about pedophiles.....i'm asking about Gays...in my eyes there is a huge difference between the two.
i will use myself as an example...when i was in my early teenage years i was attracted to young teenage girls but as i got older the age of the girls i was attracted to increased as well and then one day when i was about 25 or so i started to see girls younger then about 20 as being to young and found i wasn't attracted to them anymore.

A pedophile on the other hand is only attracted to children so although a grown man is attracted to young girls and i am attracted to women around my own age doesn't make the two of us the same.

so in my eyes 2 adults that are the same sex and are attracted to each other cant compare to an adult male that is attracted to young boys.

They are not the same in my eyes either. However, I asked if you were familiar with NAMBLA's arguments in their own defense because they use ones that are very similiar to the arguments that gays use. Not saying that means they are the same thing. Just kinda scary. That's all.

bradwright
01-23-2010, 09:09 PM
Brad, just curious here. Are you familiar with the arguments that NAMBLA uses to justify and/or defend their actions?

no i'm not but for me the only thing i need to know is are all the people involved consenting adults ? if so then fine...but if not then some involved are children and some others are pedophiles...simple really....at least it is to me.

bradwright
01-23-2010, 09:20 PM
I have to clarify. Homosexual acts are a sin, which includes lust because that requires active imagining of a sexual act (but lust would be a sin for anyone, gay or straight). Homosexuality itself is just a mental illness which can lead to sin if not controlled or cured.

most people sin everyday then.:wink:

NateR
01-23-2010, 10:37 PM
most people sin everyday then.:wink:

EVERYBODY sins everyday. Those who claim not to sin everyday are either Jesus Christ Himself or just liars and it's pretty easy to determine which one of those two possibilities applies to them. :laugh:

1 John chapter 1, verse 8 says:
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

Likewise, 1 John 1:10 repeats this with more dire consequences:
If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him (GOD) a liar, and His word is not in us.

Jewish scholars will spend their entire life devoted in study to the Bible. They do nothing else and yet they still pray everyday for forgiveness of their sins. What sins could they possibly be committing doing nothing but sitting in libraries studying GOD's Word, day in and day out? They are asking for forgiveness for the sin of ignorance. If they learn something new about GOD everyday, then that means that they must pray for forgiveness of the ignorant or false assumptions about GOD that they held the previous day.

If we don't devote ourselves to study and don't learn something new about GOD everyday, then we are guilty of the daily sin of not progressing in our faith.

So, with the exception of Jesus Christ, EVERYBODY sins EVERYDAY. Period.

Neezar
01-23-2010, 10:48 PM
no i'm not but for me the only thing i need to know is are all the people involved consenting adults ? if so then fine...but if not then some involved are children and some others are pedophiles...simple really....at least it is to me.

Well, yes, that is all you may need to know. But I wasn't responding to your views. I was responding to your surprise by the correlation that NateR was making between the two factions. I thought that if you knew that both make some of the same claims to defend themselves then it may be easier for you to see why people compare the two.

Spiritwalker
01-23-2010, 11:21 PM
After the gays get the right to force their lifestyle into everyone's face, the pedophiles are waiting in the wings to fight for their "rights" as well.

So stopping groups like NAMBLA starts with stopping the Gay Rights movement. Because once our country gets to the point where we fully accept the openly gay lifestyle, then there is no limits to the depravity we as a nation will sink to.

Though I am not shocked by what you said Nate...

One groups talks about relationships between two consenting adults...

The other talks about relationships between an adult and a child.. more often than not.. a VERY underage child..

"Gay Rights".. are talking more about the same "rights" as a heterosexual couple...

pedophilia is more about adult/child sexual relationships... and a child by definition is not an adult... so there can not be a sexual relationship.. form scores of reasons...


if two guys want to be together.. then why should it matter to you? If it's just biblical issues.. then that's another thread....

Spiritwalker
01-23-2010, 11:26 PM
EVERYBODY sins everyday. Those who claim not to sin everyday are either Jesus Christ Himself or just liars and it's pretty easy to determine which one of those two possibilities applies to them. :laugh:

1 John chapter 1, verse 8 says:
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

Likewise, 1 John 1:10 repeats this with more dire consequences:
If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him (GOD) a liar, and His word is not in us.

Jewish scholars will spend their entire life devoted in study to the Bible. They do nothing else and yet they still pray everyday for forgiveness of their sins. What sins could they possibly be committing doing nothing but sitting in libraries studying GOD's Word, day in and day out? They are asking for forgiveness for the sin of ignorance. If they learn something new about GOD everyday, then that means that they must pray for forgiveness of the ignorant or false assumptions about GOD that they held the previous day.

If we don't devote ourselves to study and don't learn something new about GOD everyday, then we are guilty of the daily sin of not progressing in our faith.

So, with the exception of Jesus Christ, EVERYBODY sins EVERYDAY. Period.

so according to your rational...

I am sinful for not knowing something.. AND I am sinful for trying to learn something... and probably sinful for knowing something..

that's where you and I miss.. big time... Nate... not that there is anything wrong with that..

If people weren't different.. life would be boring...

Henry Rollins said at a show once... If you don't have an opinion.. don't come to my table.. I think that is a great outlook on interactions with others.

You are sooooo... much an OT guy.. where as I am a blend of OT and NT.. :)

Mark
01-23-2010, 11:27 PM
if two guys want to be together.. then why should it matter to you? If it's just biblical issues.. then that's another thread....

Do you have kids? I have 3 and I dont want gays around my kids. I dont want them to think that it is right. I dont think that it is right. I dont want gays in my church either.

Mark
01-23-2010, 11:30 PM
so according to your rational...

I am sinful for not knowing something.. AND I am sinful for trying to learn something... and probably sinful for knowing something..

You dont think you sin everyday?

Neezar
01-23-2010, 11:59 PM
Though I am not shocked by what you said Nate...

One groups talks about relationships between two consenting adults...

The other talks about relationships between an adult and a child.. more often than not.. a VERY underage child..

"Gay Rights".. are talking more about the same "rights" as a heterosexual couple...

pedophilia is more about adult/child sexual relationships... and a child by definition is not an adult... so there can not be a sexual relationship.. form scores of reasons...



SpiritWalker, this is NOT about what Nate believes is right or wrong. And believe it or not it isn't about what you believe the definition of these two groups are either. GO to NAMBLA's website and read some of their arguments. If you are familiar enough with the gay rights movement and their arguments then you will recognize the arguments. If not take a peek at one of the gay advocate sites. It is shocking how NAMBLA is trying to ride right on the coattails of the gay rights movement. The man-on-man is only half their battle. And they are waiting on the gays to conquer that for them. The other half, the age, is only a recent obsticle. Your parent's generation had kids marrying old coggers as a common practice.

So this isn't about what you believe. It is what they are doing.

NateR
01-24-2010, 12:14 AM
so according to your rational...

I am sinful for not knowing something.. AND I am sinful for trying to learn something... and probably sinful for knowing something..


Well you've totally misunderstood. If I learn something new today about website design, then that means that yesterday I was either lacking that extra bit of knowledge or had a incorrect idea that was only exposed by today's gaining of knowledge. The pursuit of knowledge is not the sin. That's completely a wrong interpretation of what I said. It's the state of ignorance or fallacy that existed before the gaining of knowledge that is the sin.

It would help if we look at the Greek word used in the New Testament for sin: hamartia. This is actually an archery term that literally means "to miss the mark." (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/hamartia) Which mark are we missing? The mark of perfection. So, the New Testament writers understood sin to be more than just wrongdoing, they understood it to be a continuous state of imperfection. One that separates us from GOD.

So, if perfection is the only way into Heaven (Matthew 5:48 - "Therefore, you shall be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect."), then you can see how impossible it is for human beings who are born into a state of imperfection (sin), to make it into Heaven under their own power.

timmyja
01-24-2010, 02:19 AM
Charlie Daniels is the man.. couldn't have worded it better myself

TENNESSEAN
01-24-2010, 02:33 AM
Charlie Daniels is the man.. couldn't have worded it better myself

true that. charlies a very good man. everyone loves him around here.

Spiritwalker
01-26-2010, 02:30 AM
Do you have kids? I have 3 and I dont want gays around my kids. I dont want them to think that it is right. I dont think that it is right. I dont want gays in my church either.

I have 2.. a boy that is 9 and a girl that is 7..

I don't really want gay people around my kids.. but I don't feel that I should dictate what two consenting adults do together.

I do have a problem with people that compare homosexuality with pedophilia.

That you don't want your kids around gay people.. sure.. I have no issues with that. But they are not criminals,

God is all about forgiveness, tolerance and being kind to each other..

How would you feel if a friend "came out to you"..

I just don't understand the intolerance from people.

NateR
01-26-2010, 02:49 AM
God is all about forgiveness, tolerance and being kind to each other..


Well, that's a warped and incomplete view of GOD if I've ever heard it.

Forgiveness, I can understand where you get that from. However, GOD only forgives those who repent. So, a gay man must first admit that he is sinning by committing homosexual acts and stop living a homosexual lifestyle for GOD to forgive him.

Tolerance? Using the actual meaning of the word "tolerance" then maybe I could see where you are coming from with that. But using the modern meaning of the word? Never. GOD is righteous and perfect, He cannot tolerate sin and He will not tolerate unrepentant sin.

Being kind to each other? Yes, GOD wants us to treat others as we would like to be treated. However, that doesn't mean that we have to tolerate, endorse or in any way accept their sinful lifestyle. In fact, the Bible commands us to be holy (set apart) from this sinful world. So by Mark saying that he doesn't want any gay men around his children, he's not only being a good parent, he's being a good Christian.

Spiritwalker
01-26-2010, 03:00 AM
You dont think you sin everyday?

Man.. that is SO MUCH another thread...

Yes, I do... but...

People possibly do not have the actual Commandments handed down by God to Moses..

Organized religion controls so much about what we know and don't know.. The Church wants to keep their power..

I don't believe that God should be feared.

But at the same time.. I do not believe and religion has it right..

Isn't waste a sin? I would consider it... What about plain ol being inconsiderate?

I would like to believe that God is more of a "grandfatherly" type...

I believe that "we are an experiment"... God wants to see what happens

I want to believe that if life were discovered on other planets people wouldn't condemn that life if they had different beliefs..

I believe that praying to saints is wrong..

I want to believe many things..

I believe that I could be right.. I understand that I could be wrong.

I believe that I have these issues because of the different ways that I was told "this is what God wants".. has put me in the position to trust no "man".

Kinda messed up isn't it.

Spiritwalker
01-26-2010, 03:16 AM
Well, that's a warped and incomplete view of GOD if I've ever heard it.

As opposed to God created AIDS.. God allowed the Jews to be almost exterminated in Nazi Germany..God would call home possibly 1000s of kids without a chance to get to know Him in Hatti... If that's God.. I am scared...and I don't like the idea of being afraid of my Creator..


Forgiveness, I can understand where you get that from. However, GOD only forgives those who repent. So, a gay man must first admit that he is sinning by committing homosexual acts and stop living a homosexual lifestyle for GOD to forgive him.

But if God created the gay man/woman... then that means God sets them up to fail...hardly fair... (being that homosexuality is not a lifestyle)

If homosexuality is "learned".. then why/how does God allow his creations to be "perverted" .. how many gay people were abused as children.


Tolerance? Using the actual meaning of the word "tolerance" then maybe I could see where you are coming from with that. But using the modern meaning of the word? Never. GOD is righteous and perfect, He cannot tolerate sin and He will not tolerate unrepentant sin.

Understood.. but using homosexuality as a point of reference.. if they were "made" that way.. either nature or nurture... it becomes more difficult..


Being kind to each other? Yes, GOD wants us to treat others as we would like to be treated. However, that doesn't mean that we have to tolerate, endorse or in any way accept their sinful lifestyle. In fact, the Bible commands us to be holy (set apart) from this sinful world. So by Mark saying that he doesn't want any gay men around his children, he's not only being a good parent, he's being a good Christian.

So keeping gays away from church (no matter if they are praticing homosexuals or not) is the right thing?

Please don't misunderstand.. I do not say that I am right or wrong..You are right or wrong... it's matters like this that I have pondered most of my life..

NateR
01-26-2010, 03:23 AM
Man.. that is SO MUCH another thread...

Yes, I do... but...

People possibly do not have the actual Commandments handed down by God to Moses..

Organized religion controls so much about what we know and don't know.. The Church wants to keep their power..

I don't believe that God should be feared.

But at the same time.. I do not believe and religion has it right..

Isn't waste a sin? I would consider it... What about plain ol being inconsiderate?

I would like to believe that God is more of a "grandfatherly" type...

I believe that "we are an experiment"... God wants to see what happens

I want to believe that if life were discovered on other planets people wouldn't condemn that life if they had different beliefs..

I believe that praying to saints is wrong..

I want to believe many things..

I believe that I could be right.. I understand that I could be wrong.

I believe that I have these issues because of the different ways that I was told "this is what God wants".. has put me in the position to trust no "man".

Kinda messed up isn't it.

You must have been raised Catholic. :laugh:

Spiritwalker
01-26-2010, 03:30 AM
It's the state of ignorance or fallacy that existed before the gaining of knowledge that is the sin.

So growing up without knowledge of God is a sin? If your not taught this.. or about God.. how is that right.. I would like to believe that God doesn't condemn those that have no chance..


It would help if we look at the Greek word used in the New Testament for sin: hamartia. This is actually an archery term that literally means "to miss the mark." (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/hamartia) Which mark are we missing? The mark of perfection. So, the New Testament writers understood sin to be more than just wrongdoing, they understood it to be a continuous state of imperfection. One that separates us from GOD.

Why not use the Hebrew definition??

sin is lawlessness

Judaism says that sin is an act, and not a state of mind.. but I seem to remember that to "lust in the mind is the same as action"... something like that.

So, if perfection is the only way into Heaven (Matthew 5:48 - "Therefore, you shall be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect."), then you can see how impossible it is for human beings who are born into a state of imperfection (sin), to make it into Heaven under their own power.

Understood..but being human by definition.. we are imperfect.. even when we die.. so how does anyone make it to Heaven..?

Spiritwalker
01-26-2010, 03:30 AM
You must have been raised Catholic. :laugh:

I played with Catholicism... Not for me...

NateR
01-26-2010, 03:33 AM
As opposed to God created AIDS.. God allowed the Jews to be almost exterminated in Nazi Germany..God would call home possibly 1000s of kids without a chance to get to know Him in Hatti... If that's God.. I am scared...and I don't like the idea of being afraid of my Creator..



But if God created the gay man/woman... then that means God sets them up to fail...hardly fair... (being that homosexuality is not a lifestyle)

If homosexuality is "learned".. then why/how does God allow his creations to be "perverted" .. how many gay people were abused as children.



Understood.. but using homosexuality as a point of reference.. if they were "made" that way.. either nature or nurture... it becomes more difficult..



So keeping gays away from church (no matter if they are praticing homosexuals or not) is the right thing?

Please don't misunderstand.. I do not say that I am right or wrong..You are right or wrong... it's matters like this that I have pondered most of my life..

Proverbs 1:7a
"The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge"

GOD did not make homosexuals as homosexuals. People choose to live a homosexual lifestyle because we live in a corrupted and sinful world. Everyone (except Jesus) is born evil and must be taught to be good, even then they will NEVER be good enough to make it into Heaven. Which is why we need Jesus. Not a church, not a religion. But Jesus Christ and Him alone.

I never said that keeping gays away from a Church was a good thing. I said that Mark wanting to keep gays away from his children made him a good parent and Christian. Two completely different statements.

Gays can still attend churches, but they must accept the fact that homosexuality is a perverted and sinful lifestyle is they ever hope to get saved. GOD won't forgive us unless we repent and we can't repent if we refuse to admit that we are sinning.

NateR
01-26-2010, 03:40 AM
So growing up without knowledge of God is a sin? If your not taught this.. or about God.. how is that right.. I would like to believe that God doesn't condemn those that have no chance..

Romans 1:20
"For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse."

The mere existence of the universe and life itself is all the proof of GOD's existence that anyone needs.


Why not use the Hebrew definition??

sin is lawlessness

Judaism says that sin is an act, and not a state of mind.. but I seem to remember that to "lust in the mind is the same as action"... something like that.

Most of the teachings of Jesus were correcting the Jews' understanding of sin. Many Jewish teachers of the day said that sin was merely an outward act of disobedience, but Jesus taught that sin began in our hearts and even our thoughts condemned us to eternal damnation.

Understood..but being human by definition.. we are imperfect.. even when we die.. so how does anyone make it to Heaven..?

Through faith in Jesus Christ. That's it, everything else is lies and fantasy.

Spiritwalker
01-26-2010, 03:51 AM
Most of the teachings of Jesus were correcting the Jews' understanding of sin. Many Jewish teachers of the day said that sin was merely an outward act of disobedience, but Jesus taught that sin began in our hearts and even our thoughts condemned us to eternal damnation.




So then being a homosexual.. is a sin then. It has nothing to do with acting like a homosexual.. but thinking like a homosexual.. "desire of another man/woman"... is a sin... no matter if you do the deed or not...

Thinking about crimes... would be the same as committing the crimes in many cases..

Mark
01-26-2010, 04:37 AM
I never said that keeping gays away from a Church was a good thing. I said that Mark wanting to keep gays away from his children made him a good parent and Christian. Two completely different statements.

Gays can still attend churches, but they must accept the fact that homosexuality is a perverted and sinful lifestyle is they ever hope to get saved. GOD won't forgive us unless we repent and we can't repent if we refuse to admit that we are sinning.

1 Corinthians 5
9I have written you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people— 10not at all meaning the people of this world who are immoral, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters. In that case you would have to leave this world. 11But now I am writing you that you must not associate with anyone who calls himself a brother but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or a slanderer, a drunkard or a swindler. With such a man do not even eat.

12What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside? 13God will judge those outside. "Expel the wicked man from among you."


I don't think gay's should be in church. I don't believe people living together should be in church either.

Spiritwalker
01-26-2010, 11:03 AM
I don't think gay's should be in church. I don't believe people living together should be in church either.


You are definatley consistent then. Which is one thing many people lack.

And you do have the courage of your convictions. Another admirable trait.

Agree/Disagree.. at least you don't back down. :cool:

What about gay men/women, who abstain for the physical acts? Would they be ok to be around? More curious where the line in the sand is than anything.

KENTUCKYREDBONE
01-26-2010, 12:24 PM
1 Corinthians 5
9I have written you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral peopleŚ 10not at all meaning the people of this world who are immoral, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters. In that case you would have to leave this world. 11But now I am writing you that you must not associate with anyone who calls himself a brother but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or a slanderer, a drunkard or a swindler. With such a man do not even eat.

12What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside? 13God will judge those outside. "Expel the wicked man from among you."


I don't think gay's should be in church. I don't believe people living together should be in church either.


The sinner should not be on the Pulpit or anything like that. But as long as they behaved I would not stop them from going to church. If they actually go enough maybe they will get convicted and change!

Mark
01-26-2010, 12:39 PM
The sinner should not be on the Pulpit or anything like that. But as long as they behaved I would not stop them from going to church. If they actually go enough maybe they will get convicted and change!

You want two guys holding hands and acting in love at your church? Practicing gays have no buisness at church in my opinion. I think church is mostly for the believers.

NateR
01-26-2010, 12:59 PM
You want two guys holding hands and acting in love at your church? Practicing gays have no buisness at church in my oponion. I think church is mostly for the believers.

I agree completely. What I meant was that a homosexual who is not practicing and is actively looking to get out of that lifestyle should be welcomed into church. But, openly gay and unrepentant homosexuals have no business attending a church. First and foremost church is for believers, not unbelievers.

Spiritwalker
01-26-2010, 02:02 PM
That kinda leaves the person "wanting to belive" in a bit of a rough spot don't you think?

NateR
01-26-2010, 02:15 PM
That kinda leaves the person "wanting to belive" in a bit of a rough spot don't you think?

It kind of depends on what the person wants to believe in. If they just want something that's going to endorse whatever lifestyle they live and make them feel all warm and fuzzy inside. Then there are churches that will do that. However, that's not was a true Christian church is.

A person who wants to believe in Christianity needs to be ready to cast everything of this world aside. Jesus laid out the cost of following Him pretty clearly:

"The person who loves father or mother more than me is not worthy of Me; the person who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me." (Matthew 10:37)

The world will tell you to "be true to yourself." Jesus requires just the opposite:

"If anyone wants to come with Me, he must deny himself, take up his cross daily, and follow Me." (Luke 9:23 - emphasis added)

The world tells you to "listen to your heart," the Bible says:

He who trusts in his own heart is a fool,
But he who walks wisely will be delivered. (Proverbs 28:26)

CAVEMAN
01-26-2010, 03:32 PM
I just have to add my 2 cents here. I read a couple of posts where someone was arguing that pedophiles and homosexuality is not the same. That is wrong and it is a lie from the pit of hell. It is all sexual perversion and they all are perverts.

NateR
01-26-2010, 03:50 PM
I just have to add my 2 cents here. I read a couple of posts where someone was arguing that pedophiles and homosexuality is not the same. That is wrong and it is a lie from the pit of hell. It is all sexual perversion and they all are perverts.

Exactly, in our sinful world, what is socially acceptable changes all the time. As recently as the 1920s, the idea of a 7-year-old girl being forced to marry a 50-year-old man would not have raised too many eyebrows and would have been completely legal. However, homosexuality was treated like a crime. Now the two perversions are completely reversed in terms of social acceptance.

It just shows how fickle sinful human being are and why we need GOD's incorruptible standard of morality.

Spiritwalker
01-26-2010, 03:53 PM
I just have to add my 2 cents here. I read a couple of posts where someone was arguing that pedophiles and homosexuality is not the same. That is wrong and it is a lie from the pit of hell. It is all sexual perversion and they all are perverts.


If you remove religion from the discussion... it is two completely different things.

Including religion in the topic.. you consider the raping of a child (hererosexually or homosexually) the same as a mutual gay couple...

wow.

NateR
01-26-2010, 04:16 PM
If you remove religion from the discussion... it is two completely different things.

Including religion in the topic.. you consider the raping of a child (hererosexually or homosexually) the same as a mutual gay couple...

wow.

Well you are working under the assumption that somehow mutual consent makes everything okay. As if our bodies are our property to do with as we please.

If that's your perspective on life, then I can understand why you believe the way you do. However, not everyone thinks that way. I definitely do not.

Many of us believe that our bodies are a gift from GOD and we need to honor Him with those bodies. Using that view, what is moral becomes completely unrelated to what is consensual.

Spiritwalker
01-26-2010, 07:06 PM
Well you are working under the assumption that somehow mutual consent makes everything okay. As if our bodies are our property to do with as we please.

If that's your perspective on life, then I can understand why you believe the way you do. However, not everyone thinks that way. I definitely do not.

Many of us believe that our bodies are a gift from GOD and we need to honor Him with those bodies. Using that view, what is moral becomes completely unrelated to what is consensual.

And Moral is handed down from God and Jesus correct?

NateR
01-26-2010, 07:30 PM
And Moral is handed down from God and Jesus correct?

Yes, GOD sets the standards for morality. Which makes sense because GOD designed us, so He would know what's best for us more than we would. Just like someone who designed and built a car would know how to take care of it better than the teenage kid driving it around.

Spiritwalker
01-26-2010, 07:57 PM
Yes, GOD sets the standards for morality. Which makes sense because GOD designed us, so He would know what's best for us more than we would. Just like someone who designed and built a car would know how to take care of it better than the teenage kid driving it around.

So you understand why I have issues with the different individual belifes in what God said then, correct?

NateR
01-26-2010, 08:00 PM
So you understand why I have issues with the different individual belifes in what God said then, correct?

You need to be more specific. Exactly which "different individual beliefs" are you talking about?

KENTUCKYREDBONE
01-27-2010, 02:02 AM
You want two guys holding hands and acting in love at your church? Practicing gays have no buisness at church in my opinion. I think church is mostly for the believers.

Nope! That falls under not behaving and causing trouble!

Neezar
02-01-2010, 08:08 PM
SpiritWalker, this is NOT about what Nate believes is right or wrong. And believe it or not it isn't about what you believe the definition of these two groups are either. GO to NAMBLA's website and read some of their arguments. If you are familiar enough with the gay rights movement and their arguments then you will recognize the arguments. If not take a peek at one of the gay advocate sites. It is shocking how NAMBLA is trying to ride right on the coattails of the gay rights movement. The man-on-man is only half their battle. And they are waiting on the gays to conquer that for them. The other half, the age, is only a recent obsticle. Your parent's generation had kids marrying old coggers as a common practice.

So this isn't about what you believe. It is what they are doing.


I just have to add my 2 cents here. I read a couple of posts where someone was arguing that pedophiles and homosexuality is not the same. That is wrong and it is a lie from the pit of hell. It is all sexual perversion and they all are perverts.


Social (and the resulting legal) attitudes toward the appropriate age of consent have drifted upwards in modern times. For example, while ages from 10 to 13 were typically acceptable in western countries (http://www.matt-hughes.com/wiki/Western_world) during the mid-19th century,[1] (http://www.matt-hughes.com/forums/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=95588#cite_note-waites-0) 15 to 18 had become the norm in many countries by the end of the 20th century.[2] (http://www.matt-hughes.com/forums/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=95588#cite_note-1) However, gay rights activist Peter Tatchell (http://www.matt-hughes.com/wiki/Peter_Tatchell) in Great Britain and bioethicist Jacob Appel (http://www.matt-hughes.com/wiki/Jacob_Appel) have argued in favor of reducing the age of consent in their respective countries.[3] (http://www.matt-hughes.com/forums/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=95588#cite_note-2) Appel has argued that "pro-sex is pro-safety" and that "statutes criminalizing [teenage sex] are far more likely to harm teenagers than to help them -- whether by denying them access to necessary information, deterring them from sharing their experiences with teachers and counselors for fear that they or their partners will be reported to authorities, or driving them to have sex in parked cars and dark alleys rather than safe, warm bedrooms."[4] (http://www.matt-hughes.com/forums/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=95588#cite_note-3)



:rolleyes: As I said earlier, the pedophiles are using the gay rights activists to further their cause.

VCURamFan
02-02-2010, 12:57 AM
:rolleyes: As I said earlier, the pedophiles are using the gay rights activists to further their cause.

Denise, are you trying to imply that you're smart & are able to discern truth??????

Neezar
02-02-2010, 02:29 AM
Denise, are you trying to imply that you're smart & are able to discern truth??????

Well, I wouldn't go that far...:unsure-1:

VCURamFan
02-02-2010, 02:30 AM
Well, I wouldn't go that far...:unsure-1:

O, ok. I was gonna have to call shenanigans!! :laugh:

Neezar
02-02-2010, 02:31 AM
O, ok. I was gonna have to call shenanigans!! :laugh:

Hey Now!:angry:


:punch:




:laugh:

VCURamFan
02-02-2010, 02:34 AM
Hey Now!:angry:


:punch:




:laugh:

Do I lie? :Whistle: :tongue0011:

Neezar
02-02-2010, 02:36 AM
Do I lie? :Whistle: :tongue0011:

I can't be upset with you right now. I am still dazzled by your brillance in the Robbie thread. :laugh:

VCURamFan
02-02-2010, 02:38 AM
I can't be upset with you right now. I am still dazzled by your brillance in the Robbie thread. :laugh:

I know, I'm trying to make the most of it! :frantics: :laugh: