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View Full Version : Who do you think would win.


donaldbreland
10-21-2009, 05:20 AM
Anderson Silva vs Royce Gracie

Max
10-21-2009, 06:34 AM
really, is this some kind of joke. Roids would get killed by 75% (if not more) of the fighters in the UFC. Every champ in every division in UFC, DREAM, or Strike Force would kill him. Yes including that he/she Cyborg .

donaldbreland
10-21-2009, 07:23 AM
I meant to say Royce back in 95 vs Anderson now. My computer froze up when I submitted that. I do however think that Royce is still a very dangerous fighter. Matt Hughes over powered him and Royce under estimated Hughes. I don't think for one minute Anderson would or could beat Royce on the ground. Even today.

Buc Nasty
10-21-2009, 08:02 AM
Do you think this fight would even go to the ground?

Anderson would destroy the 1995 Royce Gracie if they fought.

County Mike
10-21-2009, 10:55 AM
The Gracies were great at the time because nobody else knew Jiu Jitsu. Now, it's been proven over and over that jiu jitsu alone is not enough. It's definitely a valuable tool and the Gracie's are some of the best, but it's not enough to win at the top level anymore. Fighters need to be a lot more well-rounded in today's UFC.

Llamafighter
10-21-2009, 12:17 PM
Royce vs Silva would look a lot like the Thales Leites fight, except I think Anderson would finish it.

KENTUCKYREDBONE
10-21-2009, 01:30 PM
Silva would win! Look how much Trouble Royce had with Kimo and Shamrock! Silva knows JJ and is a better striker than any of them 3!

Crisco
10-21-2009, 03:16 PM
Comparing Royce gracie of then to any top 20 15 fighter in any weight class would be unfair.

They all know what he knows and they are more athletic can wrestle and are good strikers.

Max
10-21-2009, 03:31 PM
I meant to say Royce back in 95 vs Anderson now. My computer froze up when I submitted that. I do however think that Royce is still a very dangerous fighter. Matt Hughes over powered him and Royce under estimated Hughes. I don't think for one minute Anderson would or could beat Royce on the ground. Even today.

even Roids from 95 would get killed by every champ in every division on UFC, DREAM or Strike Force. Like someone else said, Roids dominated when no one knew what JJ was. Since 1995 Roids is 3-2-3. In one of his 3 wins he used roids to beat Sakuraba. Once people knew what JJ was Roids was nothing more than an average fighter at best.

I also think that if the fight hit the ground Anderson would do just fine on the ground. I dont know if he would tap Roids but I dont think Roids would tap Anderson.

rearnakedchoke
10-21-2009, 04:23 PM
royce didn't fight in the sport of mma as it is today .... he would lose under today's rules because they have been adapted to favour strikers and have more action ... royce's game plan was to take you down and hold you in his guard, not take any damage, loosen you up with kidney strikes and then submit you ... he was able to beat bigger guys this way ... granted, they were all one dimensional fighters (some couldn't even be considered athletes) ... but nowadays, even if he had someone in his guard, it would be stood up due to inactivity ... royce didn't have to train striking because in his world he doesn't need to strike .. the UFC of the early days was created by the gracies to promote the gracies and bjj and they did an amazing job of it ... but to compare the two eras is irrelevant and you will never know anyway ..

Josh
10-21-2009, 06:17 PM
Royce would go for his little front kick fake and Anderson would capitalise on it and KO him in the first round, maybe the first minute. I would be more interested in Anderson/Fedor at a 220 catch weight.

donaldbreland
10-21-2009, 06:22 PM
I still think a match with Royce vs Anderson would still be more interesting now than 95% of Andersons fights since joining the UFC. I think one of Matts greates fights was against Royce. I actually believe Matt has what it takes to beat Silva just as he did Royce. I think Anderson is a great fighter but I just wish we can see him a bit more challenged.

Crisco
10-21-2009, 06:43 PM
I still think a match with Royce vs Anderson would still be more interesting now than 95% of Andersons fights since joining the UFC. I think one of Matts greates fights was against Royce. I actually believe Matt has what it takes to beat Silva just as he did Royce. I think Anderson is a great fighter but I just wish we can see him a bit more challenged.

Sorry bro disagree.

Anderson has been unchallenged because he is that much better. He fought EVERYONE at 185 and demolished them and he's beating top 5 205's now.

I'm not a huge fan of his but the guy is most definately the best fighter p4p in the world. No one matches his credentials or performances at the current time.

Anderson p4p is better then Royce could ever hope to be.

County Mike
10-21-2009, 06:58 PM
I don't think the fight between Hughes and Royce was all that good. Matt dominated him and the fight was completely one-sided. Good for Matt, but not great entertainment. Sorry but Royce is done.

donaldbreland
10-21-2009, 07:08 PM
Anderson could not beat Forest in real life. I just dont think that fight was right.

Crisco
10-21-2009, 07:20 PM
Anderson could not beat Forest in real life. I just dont think that fight was right.

Wha?

ok credibility gone.

I'm a huge Griffin fan and I watched that fight live. Forrest had NOTHING for Anderson and a rematch would go much the same in my opinion.

Max
10-21-2009, 07:29 PM
Anderson could not beat Forest in real life. I just dont think that fight was right.

um what you saw at UFC 101 was not a video game and was not a movie, it was real life and Silva crushed Forrest.

Max
10-21-2009, 07:31 PM
I don't think the fight between Hughes and Royce was all that good. Matt dominated him and the fight was completely one-sided. Good for Matt, but not great entertainment. Sorry but Royce is done.

I agree. It was fun to watch Matt crush Roids but it was not an exciting fight. Anytime that fight is on TV I dont watch it unless its the last 30 sec when Matt is punching Roids in the head over and over again.

Neezar
10-21-2009, 07:52 PM
Royce would go for his little front kick fake and Anderson would capitalise on it and KO him in the first round, maybe the first minute. I would be more interested in Anderson/Fedor at a 220 catch weight.

:laugh:

I had forgot that he had that supa-move! I think Royce might take him.

Llamafighter
10-21-2009, 07:53 PM
Anderson could not beat Forest in real life. I just dont think that fight was right.

:huh::huh::huh:

donaldbreland
10-22-2009, 12:07 AM
I must admit I started off messing around with y'all on the Royce Gracie deal but however if you really think Forest fought with every thing he had in that fight then you are mistaken. Forest did not fight in that fight. I don't want to hear about how good Anderson is either. I may have been blind in the Forest fight and I have watched it a few times over to see if I was just prejudice towards Forest because I really hate A. Silva as fighter. I do like him as a person though.
I was told by someone on here that I'm not allowed to say a fight was fixed so unless I have evidence out of the ying yang I will not say that. What I will say though is this. I see Forest in some pretty bloody wars over the last couple years. He took everything from Shogun, Rampage, Tito and twice from Bonner. I don't think Anderson could beat Rampage or Shogun nor do I think he can hit as hard as either of the two. I just don't see how Forest went down like he did with a punch that just looked weak. I don't ever see Forest just giving up in a fight and that's just what he did in that fight. I have never seen that referee before either. I also can't believe that Forest would just run out the cage and wouldn't speak for days. Does it take rain falling on your head for you to actually believe it's raining even when you see it falling down in a puddle outside.
There is a few things I want to point out and please prove me wrong if I am.
I am new to this sport. I have only been watching now for 7 years but I haven't missed a ppv in 3 years.
In A. Silvas previous three fights before Forest A.S looked horrible. He needed a big when because people were actually doubting his stay in the UFC and people were starting to say he isn't exciting anymore. What Anderson needed was a win against a former Light Heavy Weight champion to prove he is still a dominating fighter. So the UFC fed him Forest. Forest being an exciting fighter that wasn't scared to fight anyone was scared to fight. Prior to the Forest fight he was a role model to young kids who wanted to be an mma fighter. After the fight he made a comment stating how he didn't want to be a role model and that kids need to look up to someone else.
I don't know but that fight still bothers me for some reason. I mean don't say fights aren't fixed because look what Sean Salmon did. I'm not even saying if the fight was fixed that Anderson knew anything about it. Please go back and watch the fight and look at Andersons facial expressions during the fight. He really wanted to be in there and wanted to fight but Forest didn't. That's not Forests nature and thats not what made him a UFC fighter.

This is the video please watch. A couple people also think the fight was fixed. Again I'm not saying it was but isn't it weird.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Srs-bpT3pkI

Josh
10-22-2009, 04:12 AM
:laugh:

I had forgot that he had that supa-move! I think Royce might take him.

Sure seemed to work for him in the earl days though.:laugh: So funny how MMA is. I remember I thought he was unbeatable like Fedor or Anderson and he just looked so good because everyone else was so bad. I wonder if we will ever look back and say Anderson was an OK striker or Maia had Decent JJ? Maybe some day the HW division will be full of athletes like Brock with skills like Fedor. Such a cool sport.

Max
10-22-2009, 06:08 AM
I must admit I started off messing around with y'all on the Royce Gracie deal but however if you really think Forest fought with every thing he had in that fight then you are mistaken. Forest did not fight in that fight. I don't want to hear about how good Anderson is either. I may have been blind in the Forest fight and I have watched it a few times over to see if I was just prejudice towards Forest because I really hate A. Silva as fighter. I do like him as a person though.
I was told by someone on here that I'm not allowed to say a fight was fixed so unless I have evidence out of the ying yang I will not say that. What I will say though is this. I see Forest in some pretty bloody wars over the last couple years. He took everything from Shogun, Rampage, Tito and twice from Bonner. I don't think Anderson could beat Rampage or Shogun nor do I think he can hit as hard as either of the two. I just don't see how Forest went down like he did with a punch that just looked weak. I don't ever see Forest just giving up in a fight and that's just what he did in that fight. I have never seen that referee before either. I also can't believe that Forest would just run out the cage and wouldn't speak for days. Does it take rain falling on your head for you to actually believe it's raining even when you see it falling down in a puddle outside.
There is a few things I want to point out and please prove me wrong if I am.
I am new to this sport. I have only been watching now for 7 years but I haven't missed a ppv in 3 years.
In A. Silvas previous three fights before Forest A.S looked horrible. He needed a big when because people were actually doubting his stay in the UFC and people were starting to say he isn't exciting anymore. What Anderson needed was a win against a former Light Heavy Weight champion to prove he is still a dominating fighter. So the UFC fed him Forest. Forest being an exciting fighter that wasn't scared to fight anyone was scared to fight. Prior to the Forest fight he was a role model to young kids who wanted to be an mma fighter. After the fight he made a comment stating how he didn't want to be a role model and that kids need to look up to someone else.
I don't know but that fight still bothers me for some reason. I mean don't say fights aren't fixed because look what Sean Salmon did. I'm not even saying if the fight was fixed that Anderson knew anything about it. Please go back and watch the fight and look at Andersons facial expressions during the fight. He really wanted to be in there and wanted to fight but Forest didn't. That's not Forests nature and thats not what made him a UFC fighter.

This is the video please watch. A couple people also think the fight was fixed. Again I'm not saying it was but isn't it weird.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Srs-bpT3pkI

Im not sure how good of a chin Forrest has. He has been rocked or TKOed in his last 3 fights and was TKOed by Jardine (he may have been rocked in other fights I just cant remember). You said it was strange how Forrest reacted after the fight but he acted the same way after he got TKOed by Jardine. All I see in that fight was a rocked fighter moving into a jab (the moving into the jab part is something a lot of people forget. Forrest's momentum as he moved into the jab means it hit with more force than it looked) and it being the final nail in the coffin. You can never tell how much damage a punch does just by watching it on TV. Just look at the Chuck vs Vernon White fight. That ****ty little jab that Chuck hits White with damages his eye socket (if I remember correctly).

Also Silva had 2 "boring" fights not 3 and in both of those fights his opponents chose to never exchange with him. He was not given Forrest because he needed to beat a former champ as you say, he was given Forrest because the UFC knew that Forrest would come to fight which would mean that it would be an exciting fight and not 15 mins of someone scared to get hit by Silva.

Also, you have no clue how hard Silva hits. Marquardt had never been TKOed before he fought Silva, Leben had never been KOed before he fought Silva, and he KOed Irvin with one punch.

donaldbreland
10-22-2009, 07:10 AM
Your right I dont know how hard he hits but I am willing to bet he don't hit any harder than Rampage.

Buc Nasty
10-22-2009, 11:26 AM
Maybe not but he's more accurate and landed multiple clean shots, Rampage landed one clean shot and floored Forrest. Forrest was already hurt before the final knockdown, the left that put him down the second time did the most damage. Just accept it.

Buc Nasty
10-22-2009, 11:28 AM
I really hate A. Silva as fighter. I do like him as a person though.

:huh:

What do you hate about him as a fighter?

donaldbreland
10-22-2009, 05:01 PM
I don't know why buc nasty but I have always rooted for the underdog.

Llamafighter
10-22-2009, 05:44 PM
Your right I dont know how hard he hits but I am willing to bet he don't hit any harder than Rampage.

I'll take that bet. Will you be taking the punches from each guy to be the judge? :wink:

donaldbreland
10-22-2009, 07:20 PM
under one condition. It has to be filmed live on t.v and we have to give a 2 month notice. I have to make money out of this somehow lol.

atomdanger
10-22-2009, 07:53 PM
royce didn't fight in the sport of mma as it is today .... he would lose under today's rules because they have been adapted to favour strikers and have more action ... royce's game plan was to take you down and hold you in his guard, not take any damage, loosen you up with kidney strikes and then submit you ... he was able to beat bigger guys this way ... granted, they were all one dimensional fighters (some couldn't even be considered athletes) ... but nowadays, even if he had someone in his guard, it would be stood up due to inactivity ... royce didn't have to train striking because in his world he doesn't need to strike .. the UFC of the early days was created by the gracies to promote the gracies and bjj and they did an amazing job of it ... but to compare the two eras is irrelevant and you will never know anyway ..


The only logical post in this thread.

Gracie Jiu Jitsu was not built for a "sport"
Helio Gracie even went as far as to call "BJJ" Anti Jiu Jitsu.
(once BJJ became the big sport it is today)
The system of fighting wasn't set up for time limits, any actual reffing, stand ups, etc...
It certainly wasn't built for a sport with gloves,
where a strike can hit much harder and not worry about his hands.

atomdanger
10-22-2009, 07:57 PM
Oh, and in closing it really doesn't matter,
because every current UFC Champion trains in BJJ,
and in more than one case, Gracie Jiu Jitsu, so the Gracies win either way.

You can do great things in MMA with bad hands,
you can't with bad ground game.

BJ = BJJ BB, trained in GJJ
GSP = GJJ under Renzo
AS = BJJ BB
MACHIDA = BJJ BB
LESNAR = 2 years private training with Royce himself,
and hired Comprido to train him now.

Tyburn
10-25-2009, 01:08 AM
Anderson Silva vs Royce Gracie

:laugh:

Gracie




























but only in his own dreams...either now, or back then :)

Tyburn
10-25-2009, 01:09 AM
Oh, and in closing it really doesn't matter,
because every current UFC Champion trains in BJJ,
and in more than one case, Gracie Jiu Jitsu, so the Gracies win either way.

You can do great things in MMA with bad hands,
you can't with bad ground game.

BJ = BJJ BB, trained in GJJ
GSP = GJJ under Renzo
AS = BJJ BB
MACHIDA = BJJ BB
LESNAR = 2 years private training with Royce himself,
and hired Comprido to train him now.

:laugh: "and thank you Matt Hughes, for proving the Gracies the best, by beating Gracie...with...erm....skills he taught you" :rolleyes:

atomdanger
10-26-2009, 07:43 AM
:laugh: "and thank you Matt Hughes, for proving the Gracies the best, by beating Gracie...with...erm....skills he taught you" :rolleyes:

I don't see the humor?
Matt trains in BJJ does he not? I mean, his gym has a BJJ coach.
The armlock he had Royce in certainly isn't a wrestling move.
You cannot deny the impact the Gracie family has made,
just because people who don't share the last name can be better at them at mixed martial arts, doesn't mean you can be a successful fighter without knowing BJJ, you can't.

For the record, I didn't say they were the best,
I said their system was. Prove me wrong?
No mma champion doesn't work on BJJ.
As I listed, all current UFC Champions are either training with a Gracie, have trained with a Gracie, or are BJJ BB's.

Tyburn
10-26-2009, 11:42 AM
I don't see the humor?
Matt trains in BJJ does he not? I mean, his gym has a BJJ coach.
The armlock he had Royce in certainly isn't a wrestling move.
You cannot deny the impact the Gracie family has made,
just because people who don't share the last name can be better at them at mixed martial arts, doesn't mean you can be a successful fighter without knowing BJJ, you can't.

For the record, I didn't say they were the best,
I said their system was. Prove me wrong?
No mma champion doesn't work on BJJ.
As I listed, all current UFC Champions are either training with a Gracie, have trained with a Gracie, or are BJJ BB's.

For the record, the question is about ONE Gracie in particular, and nothing to do with the system at all.

Royce Gracie fighting any current champion either in our time, or in his time, is not really anything to do with his families system, which evidently he cant utilize aswell as people outside his family.

I'm sick to death of credit being given to the Gracies for every bloody win in MMA. Thats as stupid as claiming the Romans or Greeks came up with the idea of Combat Sports, and thus every win is attributed to their invention.

Besides, its not BJJ that wins, its BJJ in combination with all sorts of other things, modified by each tutor so much, it probably bears very little to the primative fundementals on which it is based. Its just sad to Rob decent people who have mastered their own set of techniques, and give grattitude to some archaic family who used/branded the techniques under their own names...but who...incidently, arent much cop, and havent been for some years

Jonlion
10-26-2009, 08:28 PM
Royce is a hero!

Great man, who fought who huge and indeed some tough guys.

Before people start calling him out, leat he had the balls to step in and do it and inspire many many people!

The fact is, his early acheivements are worthy of respect.

And Dave, you surprise me, how long is it before people spew similar stuff to you about how Matt Hughes, Chuck, Jens and Randy fought a load of failed atheletes and never really fought real competition.

Royce has earned some respect and his contribution to the sport has been immense whether you like it or not.

Tyburn
10-26-2009, 08:30 PM
Royce is a hero!

Great man, who fought who huge and indeed some tough guys.

Before people start calling him out, leat he had the balls to step in and do it and inspire many many people!

The fact is, his early acheivements are worthy of respect.

And Dave, you surprise me, how long is it before people spew similar stuff to you about how Matt Hughes, Chuck, Jens and Randy fought a load of failed atheletes and never really fought real competition.

Royce has earned some respect and his contribution to the sport has been immense whether you like it or not.

:blink: but he wouldnt win! I was asked who I thought would win...

Noone will ever DARE piss on Pulver whilst i'm around :ninja::laugh:

Jonlion
10-26-2009, 09:14 PM
:blink: but he wouldnt win! I was asked who I thought would win...

Noone will ever DARE piss on Pulver whilst i'm around :ninja::laugh:


He would'nt be able to beat Anderson today but then he has plenty of company with that one!

Max
10-27-2009, 01:20 AM
He would'nt be able to beat Anderson today but then he has plenty of company with that one!

Pulver can hardly beat any of the people in his own div.

donaldbreland
10-27-2009, 02:23 AM
Now that I think about it. I think if he got anderson to the ground he could make him tap. By the way a Royce of 1995 could beat Anderson today. I wish they would fight just so we can say yes or no but it will never happen so I guess we will never know.

Max
10-27-2009, 02:55 AM
Now that I think about it. I think if he got anderson to the ground he could make him tap. By the way a Royce of 1995 could beat Anderson today. I wish they would fight just so we can say yes or no but it will never happen so I guess we will never know.

dude Im sorry but you make Cecil People look smart

donaldbreland
10-27-2009, 03:41 AM
Look Anderson silva isn't the best thing since butter. Just like the Machida fight. Everyone said he would dominate that fight. He didn't. In fact he shouldn't have won that fight. I think Anderson will get beat in his next fight. Although I'm sad to say it will be against belfort. I think Anderson is a great fighter but so was Royce in his day. People forget that. Matt did dominate that fight and I think of all the people in the UFC Matt could beat Anderson. I'm not saying that because I am a loyal Matt Hughes fan either. I'm saying that because Anderson would under estimate Matt.
It seems people are not wanting to give Royce credit. Personally I don't like him but he is a legend. I think Anderson wouldn't go up against a 400lber and win. I want to see the UFC really test Anderson. Give him someone with a good wrestling background and a tough chin. Might seem like an odd request But I would like to see him fight Belcher. Go ahead and blast me on that one too. I would also like to see Anderson fight Cung Le. I would liek to see Anderson fight BJ Penn as well. Blast me. Go ahead

Max
10-27-2009, 03:57 AM
Look Anderson silva isn't the best thing since butter. Just like the Machida fight. Everyone said he would dominate that fight. He didn't. In fact he shouldn't have won that fight. I think Anderson will get beat in his next fight. Although I'm sad to say it will be against belfort. I think Anderson is a great fighter but so was Royce in his day. People forget that. Matt did dominate that fight and I think of all the people in the UFC Matt could beat Anderson. I'm not saying that because I am a loyal Matt Hughes fan either. I'm saying that because Anderson would under estimate Matt.
It seems people are not wanting to give Royce credit. Personally I don't like him but he is a legend. I think Anderson wouldn't go up against a 400lber and win. I want to see the UFC really test Anderson. Give him someone with a good wrestling background and a tough chin. Might seem like an odd request But I would like to see him fight Belcher. Go ahead and blast me on that one too. I would also like to see Anderson fight Cung Le. I would liek to see Anderson fight BJ Penn as well. Blast me. Go ahead

Roids beat up scrubs who did not know anything about JJ. Silva is a BJJ BB under Nog. He is one of only 3 people to sub Henderson (by the way, not sure if you know this or not but Henderson is an olympic wrestler and has never been TKOed so he would be that good wrestler with a tough chin). Silva is beating top level MMA fighters, Gracie beat mid to low level fighters who would not even be in any of the major names in MMA. There is no comparison between the two. What Matt did to Roids is what every top 10 fighter would do to Roids in every weight class.

atomdanger
10-27-2009, 05:09 AM
For the record, the question is about ONE Gracie in particular, and nothing to do with the system at all.

Royce Gracie fighting any current champion either in our time, or in his time, is not really anything to do with his families system, which evidently he cant utilize aswell as people outside his family.

I'm sick to death of credit being given to the Gracies for every bloody win in MMA. Thats as stupid as claiming the Romans or Greeks came up with the idea of Combat Sports, and thus every win is attributed to their invention.

Besides, its not BJJ that wins, its BJJ in combination with all sorts of other things, modified by each tutor so much, it probably bears very little to the primative fundementals on which it is based. Its just sad to Rob decent people who have mastered their own set of techniques, and give grattitude to some archaic family who used/branded the techniques under their own names...but who...incidently, arent much cop, and havent been for some years

Right, but my point was it doesn't matter if Royce can compete in modern MMA anymore.
His family, and their sport/martial art have won.

They brought mma to the US,
they revolutionized what YOU and everybody else thought about martial arts and it makes me sick when people do not give them credit for that.

atomdanger
10-27-2009, 05:11 AM
Roids beat up scrubs who did not know anything about JJ. Silva is a BJJ BB under Nog. He is one of only 3 people to sub Henderson (by the way, not sure if you know this or not but Henderson is an olympic wrestler and has never been TKOed so he would be that good wrestler with a tough chin). Silva is beating top level MMA fighters, Gracie beat mid to low level fighters who would not even be in any of the major names in MMA. There is no comparison between the two. What Matt did to Roids is what every top 10 fighter would do to Roids in every weight class.


IMO the two times of mma are incomparable.

Most fighters now can't take a slight nut shot or eye poke,
they wouldn't like bare knuckle, blows to the back of the head, etc...
No time limits, etc... It was a different animal,
and IMO early UFC's weren't really mma.

You can cut down Royce all you want,
but you wouldn't know about the UFC or Matt Hughes without him.

Miss Foxy
10-27-2009, 05:23 AM
You have got to be kidding me this question is very amusing... Uum Anderson would smash that fool...:laugh:

Miss Foxy
10-27-2009, 05:36 AM
Look Anderson silva isn't the best thing since butter. Just like the Machida fight. Everyone said he would dominate that fight. He didn't. In fact he shouldn't have won that fight. I think Anderson will get beat in his next fight. Although I'm sad to say it will be against belfort. I think Anderson is a great fighter but so was Royce in his day. People forget that. Matt did dominate that fight and I think of all the people in the UFC Matt could beat Anderson. I'm not saying that because I am a loyal Matt Hughes fan either. I'm saying that because Anderson would under estimate Matt.
It seems people are not wanting to give Royce credit. Personally I don't like him but he is a legend. I think Anderson wouldn't go up against a 400lber and win. I want to see the UFC really test Anderson. Give him someone with a good wrestling background and a tough chin. Might seem like an odd request But I would like to see him fight Belcher. Go ahead and blast me on that one too. I would also like to see Anderson fight Cung Le. I would liek to see Anderson fight BJ Penn as well. Blast me. Go ahead
Well not a lot of people thought an AMERICAN WRESTLER would beat the brazilian jj expert. I am sorry I think people hype up the Gracies too much. I just don't ride on that wagon for some reason.. Just my opinion though..

Max
10-27-2009, 05:44 AM
IMO the two times of mma are incomparable.

Most fighters now can't take a slight nut shot or eye poke,
they wouldn't like bare knuckle, blows to the back of the head, etc...
No time limits, etc... It was a different animal,
and IMO early UFC's weren't really mma.

You can cut down Royce all you want,
but you wouldn't know about the UFC or Matt Hughes without him.

I agree that the Gracie's made MMA what it is today but the fact remains that they are not the best MMA, or even BJJ, fighters in the world (I would like to point out that there are also other forms of submission fighting besides just BJJ). If I'm going to thank anyone in the Gracie family it would be Rorion Gracie, he is the one who started the UFC. Some people act like Royce is some type of MMA god and that is not the case, he was not even the best Gracie. He was chosen because he was smaller than the other fighters which made GJJ look even better.

Max
10-27-2009, 05:45 AM
Well not a lot of people thought an AMERICAN WRESTLER would beat the brazilian jj expert. I am sorry I think people hype up the Gracies too much. I just don't ride on that wagon for some reason.. Just my opinion though..

Matt was not an American Wrestler he was an MMA fighter. what you saw in that fight was a true MMA fighter vs a BJJ fighter.

atomdanger
10-27-2009, 05:50 AM
I agree that the Gracie's made MMA what it is today but the fact remains that they are not the best MMA, or even BJJ, fighters in the world (I would like to point out that there are also other forms of submission fighting besides just BJJ). If I'm going to thank anyone in the Gracie family it would be Rorion Gracie, he is the one who started the UFC. Some people act like Royce is some type of MMA god and that is not the case, he was not even the best Gracie. He was chosen because he was smaller than the other fighters which made GJJ look even better.


Oh I don't dispute them being the best at mma or BJJ.
I just think people seem to forget how much they have done.

I know, it was going to be Rickson.... and how sick would that have been.

atomdanger
10-27-2009, 05:51 AM
Matt was not an American Wrestler he was an MMA fighter. what you saw in that fight was a true MMA fighter vs a BJJ fighter.


Exactly.
Matt was not and has not been a wrestler for a long time IMO.
Honestly I get a little annoyed when people say that because I think Matt is pretty damn well rounded.
More so than a lot of MMA guys

Miss Foxy
10-27-2009, 05:54 AM
Matt was not an American Wrestler he was an MMA fighter. what you saw in that fight was a true MMA fighter vs a BJJ fighter.

Please don't over analyze what I meant. DUH I know he is an MMA fighter!!!!!!

Max
10-27-2009, 05:55 AM
I know, it was going to be Rickson.... and how sick would that have been.

It would have been the greatest thing ever. Interesting fact by the way, although the joke is "Rickson by armbar" he has only finished 2 of his 11 fights by armbar, he has finished 7 fights by RNC though. So the joke should be "Rickson by RNC"


And by the way if the thread was Rickson vs Anderson I would agree that if the fight hits the ground it is game over for Silva.

Miss Foxy
10-27-2009, 05:57 AM
Exactly.
Matt was not and has not been a wrestler for a long time IMO.
Honestly I get a little annoyed when people say that because I think Matt is pretty damn well rounded.
More so than a lot of MMA guys

Well he is from a wrestling background. Annoyed is when ANYONE questions my expression and opinions of MATT.. I did not see anyone de=classify his skills.. I personally have NEVER doubted him nor will I ever!

atomdanger
10-27-2009, 05:58 AM
Well he is from a wrestling background. Annoyed is when ANYONE questions my expression and opinions of MATT.. I did not see anyone de=classify his skills.. I personally have NEVER doubted him nor will I ever!

Did you just challenge me to a wrestling match? O_O

atomdanger
10-27-2009, 05:59 AM
It would have been the greatest thing ever. Interesting fact by the way, although the joke is "Rickson by armbar" he has only finished 2 of his 11 fights by armbar, he has finished 7 fights by RNC though. So the joke should be "Rickson by RNC"


And by the way if the thread was Rickson vs Anderson I would agree that if the fight hits the ground it is game over for Silva.


Yeah, Rickson would probably tap AS, even as old as he is.
But who knows, AS is pretty tough to get down, who did it last?
But Rickson definitely looks too tough, Royce didn't look tough at all.

Miss Foxy
10-27-2009, 06:01 AM
Did you just challenge me to a wrestling match? O_O
lol..I have awful ground skills!! Honestly I get confused with leg locks, and all the moves, and the lingo..trail legs ?!! lol..

atomdanger
10-27-2009, 06:02 AM
lol..I have awful ground skills!! Honestly I get confused with leg locks, and all the moves, and the lingo..trail legs ?!! lol..

haha I was just playing, but I probably have some spandex somewhere.

I have never taken a wrestling class in my life,
wait... I lied. My No Gi class is called "Submission wrestling"... Does that count?

Miss Foxy
10-27-2009, 06:03 AM
haha I was just playing, but I probably have some spandex somewhere.

I have never taken a wrestling class in my life,
wait... I lied. My No Gi class is called "Submission wrestling"... Does that count?
I have a thing for Cauliflower ears.. Sexy!! :wink:

atomdanger
10-27-2009, 06:08 AM
I have a thing for Cauliflower ears.. Sexy!! :wink:

I've always had a thing for Minnie Mouse ;)

Neezar
10-27-2009, 01:20 PM
I have a thing for Cauliflower ears.. Sexy!! :wink:

I've always had a thing for Minnie Mouse ;)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1V_-iZYIofU



:laugh:

County Mike
10-27-2009, 01:40 PM
http://img.auctiva.com/imgdata/8/1/6/6/9/0/webimg/144224295_o.jpg

Miss Foxy
10-27-2009, 04:37 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1V_-iZYIofU



:laugh:

OMG!! LOL Good one Denise!! I almost fell outta the chair!!:laugh:

Maldonado136
10-27-2009, 07:28 PM
I like where this thread has turned lol

atomdanger
10-27-2009, 07:39 PM
I like where this thread has turned lol

We go to the dark place fast.

atomdanger
10-27-2009, 07:40 PM
For the record my comment was about this picture of her as Minnie lol


http://i34.tinypic.com/2rgmmh5.jpg

donaldbreland
10-27-2009, 08:06 PM
The heck with UFC. I want to go to Disney World. Please tell me Minnie really looks like that.

County Mike
10-27-2009, 08:15 PM
I'm going to Disney the second week of November. I'll find out.

Tyburn
10-28-2009, 12:02 AM
Pulver can hardly beat any of the people in his own div.

Jens cant lose....thats the irony of it. There are only Two fighters in the whole worlds whose winning of a fight doesnt actually matter to the majority of the fanbase. Jens Pulver is one of them. Randy Couture is the Other.

Your far better off losing to Jens then beating him, the crowd wont like you if you beat him. It does your stock no good, unless you are someone of extreme importance yourself.

Tyburn
10-28-2009, 12:03 AM
Go ahead and blast me on that one too. I would also like to see Anderson fight Cung Le.

Dont think that will go down to well...even Channing Tatum can choke out Cung Le :ninja::laugh::laugh:

Tyburn
10-28-2009, 12:06 AM
They brought mma to the US,


I'm not in the US. :ninja:

I'd hail the Romans before I hailed the Gracies :laugh: or perhaps the Greeks...or better yet...why dont we just love the Chinese...they invented Martial Arts...without which the Gracies would be what :huh:

atomdanger
10-28-2009, 01:35 AM
I'm not in the US. :ninja:

I'd hail the Romans before I hailed the Gracies :laugh: or perhaps the Greeks...or better yet...why dont we just love the Chinese...they invented Martial Arts...without which the Gracies would be what :huh:


So who brought mma to the UK?
Who was the first promotion aired in the UK?

Either way, do you think MMA would be as big in the UK if it weren't for UFC?
No, not even almost, don't fool yourself.

The Gracies learned Martial Arts from a Japanese person, (and developed their art from 2 Japanese arts)
and they certainly constantly pay homage to the Japanese.

Think however you want, but you're disrespectful.
Respect is the most important lesson one should get out of any martial arts, you should get some someday.

atomdanger
10-28-2009, 01:39 AM
I get exited about the Gracies as you can tell.
We owe MMA to them IMO.

Plus I take BJJ, and love Royce and Rickson.

Max
10-28-2009, 04:33 AM
http://i34.tinypic.com/2rgmmh5.jpg

http://images.zaazu.com/img/drool-animated-animation-love-smiley-emoticon-000381-large.gif

Max
10-28-2009, 04:34 AM
I get exited about the Gracies as you can tell.
We owe MMA to them IMO.

Plus I take BJJ, and love Royce and Rickson.

i lost all respect for Royce when he used roids and his response was "well I only fight once a year at most so oh well"

atomdanger
10-28-2009, 06:07 AM
i lost all respect for Royce when he used roids and his response was "well I only fight once a year at most so oh well"

That wasn't his response, I actually talked to him about it.
I don't think he was using at all.

His tests were at levels so high they were literally off the charts.
*shrug*

The video interviews I have seen, he denied it, and said there was no point in wasting a ton of his money (Sherk) when these things don't get over turned. So he paid the 2500 and took the year off.

rearnakedchoke
10-28-2009, 05:46 PM
I'm not in the US. :ninja:

I'd hail the Romans before I hailed the Gracies :laugh: or perhaps the Greeks...or better yet...why dont we just love the Chinese...they invented Martial Arts...without which the Gracies would be what :huh:

Martial Arts was invented in India ... it was developed by people in East Asia (Japan, China etc) ..

Crisco
10-28-2009, 05:59 PM
The Gracies owe the japs more then anyone.

Judo baby.

VCURamFan
10-28-2009, 06:04 PM
The Gracies owe the japs more then anyone.

Judo baby.
This

atomdanger
10-28-2009, 08:34 PM
I was seriously asking....


So who brought mma to the UK?
Who was the first promotion aired in the UK?

Tyburn
10-28-2009, 11:02 PM
So who brought mma to the UK?
Who was the first promotion aired in the UK?

Either way, do you think MMA would be as big in the UK if it weren't for UFC?
No, not even almost, don't fool yourself.

The Gracies learned Martial Arts from a Japanese person, (and developed their art from 2 Japanese arts)
and they certainly constantly pay homage to the Japanese.

Think however you want, but you're disrespectful.
Respect is the most important lesson one should get out of any martial arts, you should get some someday.

I give respect where it is due....and btw respect is earned.

IMHO the Gracies did their part in revolutionizing the sport. But for them to blab on like nearly two decades later and pretend the game revolves around them anymore then a billion other martial arts, its not only foolish, its just plain false.

Admited by yourself, they didnt create, they stood on the shoulders of the giants before them and took it one step further, just like Zuffa stood on their shoulders and continued the work. They are a link in the chain...a worthy link...but they are not some sorta relic that half their fans make out.

Suddenly this family isnt about exploiting a good business opportunity and a clever idea of how to hoist themselves above all others, (which was their aim, it was about proving their martial art, they, were better then anyone else. That is Extreme Right...and considered very wrong) and its become almost a cult within the sport. You wait til they all start dying off...then their pictures will be hung in huge frames above the door posts of their gyms, and suddenly, a fallable human being is practically being worshipped,

of course...tiz the way in the orient. But we've moved on. We dont need to bow to them because they "invented" MMA. Now we say, half of them were rubish to begin with, and beat people on a con, and the rest are getting so old they can no longer compete...sure there is the coverted black belts..but eventually that to will be killed off, when all the blackbelts are being distributed via second generation mentors, in essence, not Gracies at all, but well rounded men who have simply incorperated the Gracie aspect also.

There are one or two Gracies I like and think are alright...Royce is not one of them. Helio was :)

atomdanger
10-28-2009, 11:08 PM
I give respect where it is due....and btw respect is earned.

IMHO the Gracies did their part in revolutionizing the sport. But for them to blab on like nearly two decades later and pretend the game revolves around them anymore then a billion other martial arts, its not only foolish, its just plain false.

Admited by yourself, they didnt create, they stood on the shoulders of the giants before them and took it one step further, just like Zuffa stood on their shoulders and continued the work. They are a link in the chain...a worthy link...but they are not some sorta relic that half their fans make out.

Suddenly this family isnt about exploiting a good business opportunity and a clever idea of how to hoist themselves above all others, (which was their aim, it was about proving their martial art, they, were better then anyone else. That is Extreme Right...and considered very wrong) and its become almost a cult within the sport. You wait til they all start dying off...then their pictures will be hung in huge frames above the door posts of their gyms, and suddenly, a fallable human being is practically being worshipped,

of course...tiz the way in the orient. But we've moved on. We dont need to bow to them because they "invented" MMA. Now we say, half of them were rubish to begin with, and beat people on a con, and the rest are getting so old they can no longer compete...sure there is the coverted black belts..but eventually that to will be killed off, when all the blackbelts are being distributed via second generation mentors, in essence, not Gracies at all, but well rounded men who have simply incorperated the Gracie aspect also.

There are one or two Gracies I like and think are alright...Royce is not one of them. Helio was :)

Hmmm, interesting thought.
1. Who did the Gracies stand on?
What giants?

I think they did a LOT,
more so than any one group of people have minus the Dana/Zuffa trio.
For a matter of point, I also give Dana/Zuffa a LOT of credit for doing what they have done for MMA.

I have also not seen any of them blab on like it revolves around them,
at all.