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rockdawg21
08-22-2009, 02:28 PM
Got this in my e-mail this morning. This is VERY real and thought it'd be nice to share it. :)

MOST OF THIS HAS ALREADY HAPPENED.

What would you say if I gave you 11 reasons why the elections in 2010 will be the most important in the history of the United States ?

1. What if I had told you in October 2008, before the last presidential election, that before Barack Obama's first 100 days in office, the federal government would be in control of both the mortgage and the banking industries? That 19 of America 's largest banks would be forced to undergo stress tests by the federal government which would determine if they were insufficiently capitalized, so they must be supervised by the government?

Would you have said, "C'mon, that will never happen in America ."

2. What if I had told you that within Barack Obama's first 100 days in office the federal government would be the largest shareholder in the US Big-Three automakers: GM, and Chrysler? That the government would kick out the CEO's of these companies and appoint hand-picked executives with zero experience in the auto industry and that executive compensation would be determined, not by a Board of Directors, but by the government?

Would you have said, "C'mon, that will never happen in America !"

3. What if I had told you that Barack Obama would appoint 21 Czars, without congressional approval, accountable only to him, not to the voters, who would have control over a wide range of US policy decisions. That there would be a Stimulus Accountability Czar, an Urban Czar, a Compensation Czar, an Iran Czar, an Auto Industry Czar, a Cyber Security Czar, an Energy Czar, a Bank Bailout Czar, and more than a dozen other government bureaucrats with unchecked regulatory powers over US domestic and foreign policy.

Would you have said, "C'mon, that will never happen in America !"

4. What if I had told you that the federal deficit would be $915 billion in the first six months of the Obama presidency - with a projected annual deficit of $1.75 trillion - triple the $454..8 billion in 2008, for which the previous administration was highly criticized by Obama and his fellow Democrats. That congress would pass Obama's $3.53 trillion federal budget for fiscal 2010... That the projected deficit over the next ten years would be greater than $10 trillion.

Would you have said, "C'mon, that will never happen in America !"

5. What if I had told you that the Obama Justice Department would order FBI agents to read Miranda rights to high-value detainees captured on the battlefield and held at US military detention facilities in Afghanistan . That Obama would order the closing of the Guantanamo detention facility with no plan for the disposition of the 200-plus individuals held there. That several of the suspected terrorists at Guantanamo would be sent to live in freedom in Bermuda at the expense of the US government. That our returning US veterans would be labeled terrorists and put on a watch list.

Would you have said, "C'mon, that will never happen in America !"

6. What if I had told you that the federal government would seek powers to seize key companies whose failures could jeopardize the financial system. That a new regulatory agency would be proposed by Obama to control loans, credit cards, mortgage-backed securities, and other financial products offered to the public.

Would you have said, "C'mon, that will never happen in America !!"

7. What if I had told you that Obama would travel to the Middle East, bow before the Saudi king, and repeatedly apologize for America 's past actions. That he would travel to Latin America where he would warmly greet Venezuela 's strongman Hugo Chavez and sit passively in the audience while Nicaraguan Marxist thug Daniel Ortega charged America with terrorist aggression in Central America.

Would you have said, "C'mon, that will never happen in America !!"

8. Okay, now what if I were to tell you that Obama wants to dismantle conservative talk radio through the imposition of a new "Fairness Doctrine." That he wants to curtail the First Amendment rights of those who may disagree with his policies via internet blogs, cable news networks, or advocacy ads. That most major network television and most newspapers will only sing his phrases like state-run media in communist countries?

Would you say, "C'mon, that will never happen in America !!!"

9. What if I were to tell you that the Obama Justice Department is doing everything it can to limit your Second Amendment rights to keep and bear arms. That the federal government wants to reinstate the so-called assault weapons ban which would prohibit the sale of any type of firearm that doesn't require the shooter to pull the trigger every time a round is fired. That Obama's Attorney General wants to eliminate the sale of virtually all handguns and ammunition, which most citizens choose for self-defense.

Would you say, "C'mon, that will never happen in America !!!"

10. What if I were to tell you that the Obama plan is to eliminate states rights guaranteed by the Tenth Amendment and give the federal government sweeping new powers over policies currently under the province of local and state governments and voted on by the people. That Obama plans to control the schools, energy production, the environment, health care, and the
wealth of every US citizen.

Would you say, "C'mon, that will never happen in America !"

11. What if I were to tell you that the president, the courts, and the federal government have ignored the US Constitution and have seized powers which the founders of our country fought to restrict. That our last presidential election may have been our last truly free election for some time to come..

I know, I know what you will say. "That will never happen in America!"

If we don't do everything in our power to stop this madness in 2010...

May God have mercy on our worthless souls.

Pass this on to every freedom loving American you can.

Thank you.

Preach
08-22-2009, 04:17 PM
Soo much of this has happened or is currently in the works.. Its a scary place

Vizion
08-22-2009, 04:52 PM
(Rev 18:4-5 NIV) Then I heard another voice from heaven say: "Come out of her (Babylon), my people, so that you will not share in her sins, so that you will not receive any of her plagues; for her sins are piled up to heaven, and God has remembered her crimes.

So long as we look to Babylon (AKA the US government or ANY form of government) for our needs, we will partake in her downfall. We need to fight to stop these monsters like Obama from ruining us, and the only way to WIN is to call upon the savior of man.

NateR
08-23-2009, 09:58 PM
5. What if I had told you that the Obama Justice Department would order FBI agents to read Miranda rights to high-value detainees captured on the battlefield and held at US military detention facilities in Afghanistan . That Obama would order the closing of the Guantanamo detention facility with no plan for the disposition of the 200-plus individuals held there. That several of the suspected terrorists at Guantanamo would be sent to live in freedom in Bermuda at the expense of the US government. That our returning US veterans would be labeled terrorists and put on a watch list.

This right here should be proof positive of just how backwards and illogical the Liberal mind is.

Bonnie
08-23-2009, 10:48 PM
Like Preach said, it's a scary place and Obama's just getting started.

I'm praying he does not get re-elected if he chooses to run again.

KENTUCKYREDBONE
08-23-2009, 11:05 PM
Like Preach said, it's a scary place and Obama's just getting started.

I'm praying he does not get re-elected if he chooses to run again.

If he does run again be assured than Micky Mouse and a few grave yards will vote for him!

Tyburn
08-24-2009, 12:51 AM
If we don't do everything in our power to stop this madness in 2010...

.
Its Too Late :scared0011:

The thing is, we both know, to get this done properly would take more then a single term, and that he's unlikely to sit a double term...so dont worry. The next Republican President will simply undo Everything Obama has started to do. :w00t:

que
08-24-2009, 05:30 PM
it will be interesting to see who wins the next election. if not obama, i bet it will be some new charismatic liberal who is not as far left as obama was... someone who is more towards the center, yet still liberal... and maybe even a good looking female, like sarah palin... to pull in all the female voters. it's a long ways off though. we haven't even gotten past the first year of obama yet. pull up your overalls buddies, we are in it for the long haul

Tyburn
08-24-2009, 05:55 PM
it will be interesting to see who wins the next election. if not obama, i bet it will be some new charismatic liberal who is not as far left as obama was... someone who is more towards the center, yet still liberal... and maybe even a good looking female, like sarah palin... to pull in all the female voters. it's a long ways off though. we haven't even gotten past the first year of obama yet. pull up your overalls buddies, we are in it for the long haul
See, I think that if Obamas presidency goes sour and overcast, the public are less likely to go for a Woman President. In essence, they treated the Obama Campaign as a risk because of his Skin Tone...A woman, because she is Female would also be seen as a Risk. If this doesnt go down to well, the public might go for someone very boring, very bland, very safe. Niether harsh Conservative, nor Harsh Liberal (and yet probably a Republican to chastize the Democrats for Obama)

The Ironey of Gorden Brown in England as Prime Minister is that had he gone for a snap election right after Blair had gone, he would have won, simply on the fact that he was far less hot on being subject to America. The "special relationship" was very much between two men, rather then two countries, Gordon Brown and Barack Obama, do not have the same political relationship that was shared between George Bush and Tony Blair, and I think that also helpped people accept the two. In England, Gordon was less inclined to play the part of Governor, and in America, Barack was more inclined to tackle Domestic Issues then Foreign Policy.

The sad thing is, Obamas focus on Domestic Issues ISNT endearing him to the Public, and Gordon Brown got cold feet and waited to long to call a snap ellection. Now we all see that Barack Obama isnt a dead cert for a second Term, and Gordon Brown is unlikely to ever be ellected. This time next year he'll probably be sitting slumpped over in the House of Lords :laugh:

rearnakedchoke
08-24-2009, 06:02 PM
Why are the elections in 2010? I thought the presidential vote would be in 2012? Take it easy on me, I am canadian ...

Tyburn
08-24-2009, 06:08 PM
Why are the elections in 2010? I thought the presidential vote would be in 2012? Take it easy on me, I am canadian ...
At a guess I would say because of the way the voting works. If you think about it, the Campaigns as the votes come in will take nearly a whole year! thats 2011, and before then, surely the Candidates have to be named and begin working on a preliminary campaign so by the time they get the votes the are well known.

I suppose this means that it all probably kicks off around the fall of 2010

??

Crisco
08-24-2009, 06:46 PM
You guys are insane if you think Obama will not get re-elected.

All the republicans can put forward to run is Sarah Palin and she is in my belief the main reason Mccain lost.

Tyburn
08-24-2009, 07:28 PM
You guys are insane if you think Obama will not get re-elected.

All the republicans can put forward to run is Sarah Palin and she is in my belief the main reason Mccain lost.
They need to put up candidates from the Bush Administration.

Whatever happened to Colin Powell. He would have made an excellent President.

Condi Rice would have the stamina to be President...not that I would agree at all with half her policies I would imagine, but she could catch on.

Surely, they dont JUST have that strange Alaskan Woman :unsure:

rearnakedchoke
08-24-2009, 08:22 PM
You guys are insane if you think Obama will not get re-elected.

All the republicans can put forward to run is Sarah Palin and she is in my belief the main reason Mccain lost.
Bobby Jindal .. he will be the saviour of America ...

Crisco
08-24-2009, 09:05 PM
Bobby Jindal .. he will be the saviour of America ...

Lol Jindal is a pip squeek with dark skin. The skin being the only reason he will be considered. The repubs will want a dark face against Obama.

He is not really good at anything and doesn't have an exceptional look about him.

He doesn't have a chance. The only one to beat Obama is possibly Colin Powell but he has a Bush past and the Dems will use it against him.

Obama will go unchallenged mark my words.

9-10 of ten people still don't know his true politics so they will vote for him again because it's change they can believe in.

rockdawg21
08-24-2009, 09:26 PM
Why are the elections in 2010? I thought the presidential vote would be in 2012? Take it easy on me, I am canadian ...
Because in 2010, we will have the opportunity to change the Congressional Powers in the U.S. to the Republican Party. This would severely diminish Obama's policy-making power.

Crisco
08-24-2009, 09:57 PM
Because in 2010, we will have the opportunity to change the Congressional Powers in the U.S. to the Republican Party. This would severely diminish Obama's policy-making power.

You can't stop Obama.

America is the new Rome and the mob definately does rule in the end.

Tyburn
08-24-2009, 10:18 PM
Because in 2010, we will have the opportunity to change the Congressional Powers in the U.S. to the Republican Party. This would severely diminish Obama's policy-making power.
You mean do a reverse of what happened to Bush when he lost control of Senate and Congress?

In other words you can make a Democratic President incharge of a Republican Senate and Congress...so that He cant do much without their consent, and force him to play his Veto everytime a vote goes against him.

Basically, Local Government. If you can make the opposition more powerful in numbers then the Government, then the opposition becomes the Government, but the President doesnt Change. :ninja:

bradwright
08-24-2009, 10:26 PM
Bobby Jindal .. he will be the saviour of America ...
lol...thats a good one...Bobby Jindal...lol...sorry but if you are pinning your hopes on him then Obama will win a second term easily,Sara would do better.

NateR
08-25-2009, 02:17 AM
Why are the elections in 2010? I thought the presidential vote would be in 2012? Take it easy on me, I am canadian ...

Every two years there are elections held for Congress. I believe a lot of the Democrats in Congress are up for re-election in 2010. Those Democrats make up most of Obama's power base, so if too many of them lose their seats, then, even if Obama gets a second term, he'll be a lame duck with little influence or power.

rearnakedchoke
08-25-2009, 01:14 PM
Every two years there are elections held for Congress. I believe a lot of the Democrats in Congress are up for re-election in 2010. Those Democrats make up most of Obama's power base, so if too many of them lose their seats, then, even if Obama gets a second term, he'll be a lame duck with little influence or power.
I see ... that's what I thought .. thanks ...

mikthehick
09-01-2009, 07:26 PM
Why are the elections in 2010? I thought the presidential vote would be in 2012? Take it easy on me, I am canadian ...

RNC, because the insanely run Democratic congress now has a majority of the seats. Together with Mr. Obama, they are on a conquest to ruin America. This country has a system of "checks and balances", so right now, with a majority of the seats in Congress (the house and the senate) being Democrats, and the president being a democrat, well, you see their is an intense Liberal movement in America.

What's even funnier is the same people who voted for these wonderful people to run our country are now sh-tting in their pants.

With the elections of 2010, the GOP (Republican) party has a chance to take back a majority of Congress. And as of today, that may not be such a hard obstacle for them.

Virginia, my state, currently has a Democrat as a governor, and in the governor's race this year, the Republican, Mr. Bob McDonnell, has a 10 point lead over his opponent. VA did vote over 60% for Mr. Obama last November.

I can tell you that someone who is charasmatic and bellows out empty promises and is a socialist will NEVER get my vote.

Tyburn
09-01-2009, 08:02 PM
RNC, because the insanely run Democratic congress now has a majority of the seats. Together with Mr. Obama, they are on a conquest to ruin America. This country has a system of "checks and balances", so right now, with a majority of the seats in Congress (the house and the senate) being Democrats, and the president being a democrat, well, you see their is an intense Liberal movement in America.

What's even funnier is the same people who voted for these wonderful people to run our country are now sh-tting in their pants.

With the elections of 2010, the GOP (Republican) party has a chance to take back a majority of Congress. And as of today, that may not be such a hard obstacle for them.

Virginia, my state, currently has a Democrat as a governor, and in the governor's race this year, the Republican, Mr. Bob McDonnell, has a 10 point lead over his opponent. VA did vote over 60% for Mr. Obama last November.

I can tell you that someone who is charasmatic and bellows out empty promises and is a socialist will NEVER get my vote.

You call it "checks and ballences" but actually it just shows that the overwhelming majority of the American Citizanry are Fickle. In less then a year they have completely changed their mind.

They wanted Obama and the Liberals...several months later,...to much liberality and Obama has broken a promise or two...and then they want Republican.

But the majority are not Partisan, thats the problem. You have your sworne Liberals who will only EVER vote Liberal, and you have your Sworne Republican who will only EVER vote Republican.

But those people that make the difference are, in essence, niether Democrat nor Republican...they are whatever suits their mood, and their moods change. Consider it is these fairweather voters who actually determin American Politics...and its usually ping-pong.

Its the same in almost any country where the populas en mass are allowed to vote freely.

So...When the Republicans get control of Congress and Senate again...remember...its not because the majority of people voted Republican because they LOVE Republicans...its simply a knee-jerk reaction to the Democrats...and...when The next President is Republican...this will be turned on its head...and the Liberals will be saying almost exactly the same thing.

Rome is The Mob...and the Mob is fickle and fairweather...thats why Bush ended his term and is disliked...because he actually did what a Government is supposed to do in several key areas, and effectively, he ignored the fickle majority continuing to do what they had ASKED Him to do BEFORE they changed their mind. But when Obamas time comes, he'll slip quietly into the night whilst trying to appease everyone...the thing which America fails to understand is...you cant please everyone all the time...and I dont believe a Government should. The Mob each things the Government belongs to them, but they all change their minds on everything all the time.

mikthehick
09-02-2009, 01:56 AM
You call it "checks and ballences" but actually it just shows that the overwhelming majority of the American Citizanry are Fickle. In less then a year they have completely changed their mind.

They wanted Obama and the Liberals...several months later,...to much liberality and Obama has broken a promise or two...and then they want Republican.

But the majority are not Partisan, thats the problem. You have your sworne Liberals who will only EVER vote Liberal, and you have your Sworne Republican who will only EVER vote Republican.

But those people that make the difference are, in essence, niether Democrat nor Republican...they are whatever suits their mood, and their moods change. Consider it is these fairweather voters who actually determin American Politics...and its usually ping-pong.

Its the same in almost any country where the populas en mass are allowed to vote freely.

So...When the Republicans get control of Congress and Senate again...remember...its not because the majority of people voted Republican because they LOVE Republicans...its simply a knee-jerk reaction to the Democrats...and...when The next President is Republican...this will be turned on its head...and the Liberals will be saying almost exactly the same thing.

Rome is The Mob...and the Mob is fickle and fairweather...thats why Bush ended his term and is disliked...because he actually did what a Government is supposed to do in several key areas, and effectively, he ignored the fickle majority continuing to do what they had ASKED Him to do BEFORE they changed their mind. But when Obamas time comes, he'll slip quietly into the night whilst trying to appease everyone...the thing which America fails to understand is...you cant please everyone all the time...and I dont believe a Government should. The Mob each things the Government belongs to them, but they all change their minds on everything all the time.

Wow Dave, way to go off the cliff with the rest of the lemmings.....

I call it "checks and balances" because that is what they teach in AP US Government. When one branch of government gets too powerful (judicial, legislative, or executive), they 'check' each other and it all balances out. So really, yes Obama will 'try' to 'change' everything, but that won't happen completely because this government was founded on the Constitution and the Founding Fathers knew their stuff.

Yes he may 'change' stuff, but at this rate, they are driving the gov't off that cliff with the lemmings. Luckily, I believe in a Higher power and I also believe that not all is lost.

And one more thing, I wish you'd stop referring to America as Rome and it's citizens as the Mob. It's getting really old.

I'm not stupid and I'm not a hugely political person either. I'm a member of the Constitution Party, but registered Republican, and the freedom that makes this country a great one is being able to vote on what issues we agree and disagree with.

You basically imply that Americans change their minds with whatever their mood is for that day. That is a wrong assumption.

I don't change my mind on the issues, I've always been pro-gun, pro-life, pro-Constitution, and pro-ethics and morals.

Assuming things shows ignorance, just a thought.

logrus
09-02-2009, 02:11 AM
Im voting for whomever Nate and Rocks are not. I love pissing them off. :frantics:

Tyburn
09-02-2009, 12:10 PM
Wow Dave, way to go off the cliff with the rest of the lemmings.....

1)I call it "checks and balances" because that is what they teach in AP US Government. When one branch of government gets too powerful (judicial, legislative, or executive), they 'check' each other and it all balances out. So really, yes Obama will 'try' to 'change' everything, but that won't happen completely because this government was founded on the Constitution and the Founding Fathers knew their stuff.

Yes he may 'change' stuff, but at this rate, they are driving the gov't off that cliff with the lemmings. Luckily, I believe in a Higher power and I also believe that not all is lost.

2) And one more thing, I wish you'd stop referring to America as Rome and it's citizens as the Mob. It's getting really old.

I'm not stupid and I'm not a hugely political person either. I'm a member of the Constitution Party, but registered Republican, and the freedom that makes this country a great one is being able to vote on what issues we agree and disagree with.

3)You basically imply that Americans change their minds with whatever their mood is for that day. That is a wrong assumption.

I don't change my mind on the issues, I've always been pro-gun, pro-life, pro-Constitution, and pro-ethics and morals.

Assuming things shows ignorance, just a thought.
1) "They "check" each other" ???

No, the public "checks" the Government actually. which is the very point I was making. Its not the Republicans who will "check" the Democrats, its those people who voted Democrat, have become dissapointed, are not partisan, and so vote Republican instead, that will do the "checking" and it has nothing to do with your Consitution. Its a principle of any democratically ellected Government, that the majority will vote in one, change their minds, then vote in the other, then change their minds et al ad infinitum, UNLESS there is a circumstance that focuses the national attention, or one side is vastly lacking in nominations.

That is Degree level Philosophy of Politics

2) I am not comparing. Again, another point you seem to have missed. Could be Rome, could be London, Could be Washington, could be ANY Democratically Ellected Government. The SAME force that drives the Lynch Mob, drives the Ellectorate.

That is Degree level Political Evolution

3) Finally. Try reading. I said there was a small number of partisans who are FIXED. If you are one of them, bully for you...but let it be known, you have to convince the majority of people who DO change their minds, are not Card Carrying political members...because its where the bulk of THEM go that will determin the result.

...and they notoriously change their minds to suit whatever principle is best at the time. SO get a strong Republican who inspires them with patriotism, and they will follow him...in EXACTLY the same way they followed Plush Speaking Obama.

Obama won because he influenced, not the Democrats...but he influenced those people who were non partisan..not political. It wasnt the democrats that made him successful is was the mob. Get the mob behind YOUR party, and you will win until they tire of you. Thats just the way large groups of people work...I'll give you a good example.

When George Bush went to War everyone was behind him....Now they pretend they were not. They have changed their minds. The Anti-War Democrats several years ago were supporters of the war. So its not an assumption Kim...this is the way large Hive minds work...and its nothing personal to the United States...it happens everywhere in countries where the populas is allowed an influence.

mikthehick
09-02-2009, 04:27 PM
1) "They "check" each other" ???

No, the public "checks" the Government actually. which is the very point I was making. Its not the Republicans who will "check" the Democrats, its those people who voted Democrat, have become dissapointed, are not partisan, and so vote Republican instead, that will do the "checking" and it has nothing to do with your Consitution. Its a principle of any democratically ellected Government, that the majority will vote in one, change their minds, then vote in the other, then change their minds et al ad infinitum, UNLESS there is a circumstance that focuses the national attention, or one side is vastly lacking in nominations.

That is Degree level Philosophy of Politics

2) I am not comparing. Again, another point you seem to have missed. Could be Rome, could be London, Could be Washington, could be ANY Democratically Ellected Government. The SAME force that drives the Lynch Mob, drives the Ellectorate.

That is Degree level Political Evolution

3) Finally. Try reading. I said there was a small number of partisans who are FIXED. If you are one of them, bully for you...but let it be known, you have to convince the majority of people who DO change their minds, are not Card Carrying political members...because its where the bulk of THEM go that will determin the result.

...and they notoriously change their minds to suit whatever principle is best at the time. SO get a strong Republican who inspires them with patriotism, and they will follow him...in EXACTLY the same way they followed Plush Speaking Obama.

Obama won because he influenced, not the Democrats...but he influenced those people who were non partisan..not political. It wasnt the democrats that made him successful is was the mob. Get the mob behind YOUR party, and you will win until they tire of you. Thats just the way large groups of people work...I'll give you a good example.

When George Bush went to War everyone was behind him....Now they pretend they were not. They have changed their minds. The Anti-War Democrats several years ago were supporters of the war. So its not an assumption Kim...this is the way large Hive minds work...and its nothing personal to the United States...it happens everywhere in countries where the populas is allowed an influence.

Since you numbered my post, I guess I'll have to number this....

1) Checks and Balances--this isn't a term I made up, honestly, it's something I learned in 8th Grade and 12th grade government. I'm not at all disagreeing with you, and do think the public should "check" the gov't to make sure they are doing their job. But also in the 3 branches of the gov't, they check each other to make sure neither of them get too powerful. This seems counterintuitive, especially when Mr. Obama and Mrs. Pelosi are hell bent on bankrupting the US with their ridiculous 'pork and barrel' legislation.

Unfortunately, as you said, 'fickle' American's are sh-tting in their pants because the person whom they voted for, who said he would 'share the wealth', really meant that wealth was going to only be shuffled around the gov't and not it's citizens.

This is a republic, and should be as such. America is headed toward socialism fast, which is why the third parties are rising up in battlecries. If this massive Health Care bill passes in a couple weeks, the road to a Socialist Regime begins.

2) I still don't see how a "lynch" mob is relevant to this, so I'm dropping it.

3) I did read your post, thanks. It just seems that sometimes, on the forums, you have a 'high and mighty' attitude about stuff and I got kinda upset. I'm so freaking tired of people assuming and judging others when then have 'no idea' about what life is like for those people. Like the analogy, "Walk a mile in their shoes, then get back to me."

People tend to judge and lash out when they are threatened. It sucks, but it's true. In the process, feelings get hurt.

I have nothing wrong to say about friendly debates, but a lot of the time, things get out of hand, name-calling ensues, and it's a huge turn off. If you are going to say something worthy of defending, back it up with factual and/or circumstancial evidence.

Just a thought.

TexasRN
09-02-2009, 04:44 PM
Dave, checks and balances has nothing at all to do with political parties. Doesn't matter one whit if you are Republican or Democrat. It has to do with the 3 branches of the US Govt. and making sure the power doesn't get too lopsided.

http://www.swic.edu/adultbasiced/constitution/3branches.htm

You know a lot about the US but there are things you just don't understand. You approach us from your own perspective and you won't be able to fully see who we are as a whole while doing this. The American public IS the govt. The money is OUR money. They work FOR us doing what WE want them to do. Yeah, they screw up. No, it isn't a perfect system. Politicians lie and promise things they can't deliver. Americans are fickle and easily persuaded by the media. We don't educate ourselves enough before voting. We tend to only care about America and do not pay much attention to world politics (general pop. Americans). But it's a better system than what other countries have so I'll keep it.

I am not great at explaining things and don't want to cause a ruckus with you. I am just saying that when it comes to American politics you really are limited if you don't try to view us without the British glasses on.


~Amy

Tyburn
09-02-2009, 05:41 PM
Since you numbered my post, I guess I'll have to number this....

1) Checks and Balances--this isn't a term I made up, honestly, it's something I learned in 8th Grade and 12th grade government. I'm not at all disagreeing with you, and do think the public should "check" the gov't to make sure they are doing their job. But also in the 3 branches of the gov't, they check each other to make sure neither of them get too powerful. This seems counterintuitive, especially when Mr. Obama and Mrs. Pelosi are hell bent on bankrupting the US with their ridiculous 'pork and barrel' legislation.

Unfortunately, as you said, 'fickle' American's are sh-tting in their pants because the person whom they voted for, who said he would 'share the wealth', really meant that wealth was going to only be shuffled around the gov't and not it's citizens.

2)This is a republic, and should be as such. America is headed toward socialism fast, which is why the third parties are rising up in battlecries. If this massive Health Care bill passes in a couple weeks, the road to a Socialist Regime begins.

3) I still don't see how a "lynch" mob is relevant to this, so I'm dropping it.

4) I did read your post, thanks. It just seems that sometimes, on the forums, you have a 'high and mighty' attitude about stuff and I got kinda upset. I'm so freaking tired of people assuming and judging others when then have 'no idea' about what life is like for those people. Like the analogy, "Walk a mile in their shoes, then get back to me."

People tend to judge and lash out when they are threatened. It sucks, but it's true. In the process, feelings get hurt.

I have nothing wrong to say about friendly debates, but a lot of the time, things get out of hand, name-calling ensues, and it's a huge turn off. If you are going to say something worthy of defending, back it up with factual and/or circumstancial evidence.

Just a thought.
1) A question for you. Does everyone in your public education system study "Government" and is it really politics, or is it just the study of your own Government?

We dont do Governmental Studies of any kinda until possibly GCSE. Mostly it has to be something you do if you choose to stay in the education after getting the very basic awards. I studied at Degree level (for the first time) three modules which could be described as Political Studies, two were funded by the Department of Peace Studies, and they included Global Peace and Security (which was more about the United Nations and International Law) and Strategic Studies (which was primarily a look at the United States Forces when it comes to Military Strategy....we had a live case study...they spent that VERY Semester invading Iraq :laugh: So rather then read out of text books...we kinda had a demonstration :blink: ) and a Module funded by the Department of Social Sciences and Humanities, which was Political Philosophy, which was sort of covered the different types of Political environments at work throughout time, and how they have changed and almost organically evolved

2) Actually thats not true. America would move further to the Left, but she wont be "Socialist" I think that being inside America you dont understand how far RIGHT your Government is and always has been. Barack Obama by the Worlds Standards is NOT EVEN LEFT OF CENTER!!!

Try to understand that your most Left, is actually only Centrist. Your government would become a Centrist Government quite possibly if you had a nationaliszed Health Service...much like any other Democratic Country.

You used the word "Republic" That has a lot more to do with HOW you vote, rather then the outcome of the Governments persuasion. So its a complete over-reaction and not true to say your Government will ever be Socialist...when in the Spectrum of Politics, really Obama can only move it from Right to Centre....which I suspect he will fail at...because firstly he hasnt got the time, and secondly, the one thing about a Centrist Government that your Citizenry wont like long term is the loss of something defining your identity on the political spectrum. in order to be Patriotic you have to have something defining to hold in high regard. If your Government is either Right or Left, that in itself is a defining feature...but if your Government moves to centre...well...it could be like any Government in Europe...there would thus be far less Americanism within your Government

3) :laugh:

4) I am not trying to threaten you. :scared0011:

Tyburn
09-02-2009, 05:55 PM
Dave, checks and balances has nothing at all to do with political parties. Doesn't matter one whit if you are Republican or Democrat. It has to do with the 3 branches of the US Govt. and making sure the power doesn't get too lopsided.

http://www.swic.edu/adultbasiced/constitution/3branches.htm

You know a lot about the US but there are things you just don't understand. You approach us from your own perspective and you won't be able to fully see who we are as a whole while doing this. The American public IS the govt. The money is OUR money. They work FOR us doing what WE want them to do. Yeah, they screw up. No, it isn't a perfect system. Politicians lie and promise things they can't deliver. Americans are fickle and easily persuaded by the media. We don't educate ourselves enough before voting. We tend to only care about America and do not pay much attention to world politics (general pop. Americans). But it's a better system than what other countries have so I'll keep it.

I am not great at explaining things and don't want to cause a ruckus with you. I am just saying that when it comes to American politics you really are limited if you don't try to view us without the British glasses on.


~Amy
Well, I'm learning more and more. The area I know least about the US would be the Judiciary, which I know next to nothing about, and the Congress which I know a fair bit...but not really in detail...I havent a clue about your local Government at all...and I bet they are each different also

See...you say you dont educate yourselves enough before voting...A lot of English people dont vote at all :unsure: We arent so easily persuaded by the media, practically because the Media is the main outlet used to express public opinion. Media is usually the voice of the people, not a voice TO the people.

I have certainly come up across, and Americans are well known for it, the attitude that America matters, and nothing else does. Part of that is because America is such a large country, that for those inside of it, she is everywhere, America, unlike other countries, is hours and hours across, you can travel through many states and still only be in America. Secondly, because of her History she is quite young, and young Nations always think they know best. She is also relatively unchallenged because of her Geography. She hasnt faced proper full scale and regular invasion, she has not faced daily bombardment by air or by sea...and her boarders are extremely peaceful. This has allowed her to grow up in a protected environment that not many other countries have ever experienced.

Finally...its a product of Nationalism. America is a Political Right Nation, it always has been. That means that she will be patriotic, and her focus is on herself and she truely loves what she sees, and everything else pales by comparison.

Its not a bad thing by moderation, and to be fair, She IS moderate unless she is upset. Also plenty of Americans have the ability when challenged to comprehend and notice the value of other Nations

I found your linkey-doo very eye-opening :) It is true that our Cultures are two DIFFERENT cultures, we must all remember that during discussions of this nature :ashamed:

Chris F
09-02-2009, 06:31 PM
What Dave has said here has a lot of truth to it. America does have a tendency to become bored and change their mind and turn on those who they adored. Also the image of a mob is very true. Thus why America like Rome tosses free bread and circuses to the mob to keep their mind of their loss of freedom.

Kim is also right in that we were once a republic but now have diminished ourselves to what our founders feared and that is a full blown democracy. So now with the right amount of money and a nifty puppet show you can stir the masses and get whatever you want. A republic was a nation of law now we are a nation of whims.

mikthehick
09-02-2009, 07:11 PM
Dave,

1) If one goes through 12th grade in the US, yes they will study the US Government. Any further study is the discretion of the individual.

2) I have no idea what you are trying to explain.

3) Thanks for numbering my paragraphs for me--I'm too dumb to do it myself.

4) What Amy said.....

I'm ending this now before I get pissed.



1) A question for you. Does everyone in your public education system study "Government" and is it really politics, or is it just the study of your own Government?

We dont do Governmental Studies of any kinda until possibly GCSE. Mostly it has to be something you do if you choose to stay in the education after getting the very basic awards. I studied at Degree level (for the first time) three modules which could be described as Political Studies, two were funded by the Department of Peace Studies, and they included Global Peace and Security (which was more about the United Nations and International Law) and Strategic Studies (which was primarily a look at the United States Forces when it comes to Military Strategy....we had a live case study...they spent that VERY Semester invading Iraq :laugh: So rather then read out of text books...we kinda had a demonstration :blink: ) and a Module funded by the Department of Social Sciences and Humanities, which was Political Philosophy, which was sort of covered the different types of Political environments at work throughout time, and how they have changed and almost organically evolved

2) Actually thats not true. America would move further to the Left, but she wont be "Socialist" I think that being inside America you dont understand how far RIGHT your Government is and always has been. Barack Obama by the Worlds Standards is NOT EVEN LEFT OF CENTER!!!

Try to understand that your most Left, is actually only Centrist. Your government would become a Centrist Government quite possibly if you had a nationaliszed Health Service...much like any other Democratic Country.

You used the word "Republic" That has a lot more to do with HOW you vote, rather then the outcome of the Governments persuasion. So its a complete over-reaction and not true to say your Government will ever be Socialist...when in the Spectrum of Politics, really Obama can only move it from Right to Centre....which I suspect he will fail at...because firstly he hasnt got the time, and secondly, the one thing about a Centrist Government that your Citizenry wont like long term is the loss of something defining your identity on the political spectrum. in order to be Patriotic you have to have something defining to hold in high regard. If your Government is either Right or Left, that in itself is a defining feature...but if your Government moves to centre...well...it could be like any Government in Europe...there would thus be far less Americanism within your Government

3) :laugh:

4) I am not trying to threaten you. :scared0011:

Tyburn
09-02-2009, 07:11 PM
What Dave has said here has a lot of truth to it. America does have a tendency to become bored and change their mind and turn on those who they adored. Also the image of a mob is very true. Thus why America like Rome tosses free bread and circuses to the mob to keep their mind of their loss of freedom.

Kim is also right in that we were once a republic but now have diminished ourselves to what our founders feared and that is a full blown democracy. So now with the right amount of money and a nifty puppet show you can stir the masses and get whatever you want. A republic was a nation of law now we are a nation of whims.
But a full blown democrasy is NOT a Socialist or Communist State.

Yes...basically, what this COULD signify is America moving from Nationalism to Centrism. That would bassically leave the "Republic" bit as...well...not really all the a Republic could be. Certainly, the whim of the people, describes completely democrasy...you see it more in America, because the option to legally change your whim happens more often...in a Democratic State the whim option is only available once a decade or so...in a Socialist State...its never available

So the way the Government avoid this whims is to give less chances to the public to vote...therby ensuring whatever the public feel, that once a ballot is done, for a while, the government chosen does its job no matter how badly for a reasonable ammount of time.

Say for example, they did the 2012 ellections at the same time as the Presidential Ellections...then you would have to wait for the next Presidential Ellection before you get to change control of the Senate...which would at least mean The Government wouldnt be constantly shifting

Course you believe thats GOOD because shift avoids stagnacy...and ultimately scuppers a would-be dictator :ninja:

Course...you'd be buggered if you ever managed to lose your constitution...thats what I most fear...what would happen if your Government could either change the Constitution whenever it wanted to (like Common Law) OR aggree not to follow it all together. :sad:

Crisco
09-02-2009, 07:38 PM
But a full blown democrasy is NOT a Socialist or Communist State.

Yes...basically, what this COULD signify is America moving from Nationalism to Centrism. That would bassically leave the "Republic" bit as...well...not really all the a Republic could be. Certainly, the whim of the people, describes completely democrasy...you see it more in America, because the option to legally change your whim happens more often...in a Democratic State the whim option is only available once a decade or so...in a Socialist State...its never available

So the way the Government avoid this whims is to give less chances to the public to vote...therby ensuring whatever the public feel, that once a ballot is done, for a while, the government chosen does its job no matter how badly for a reasonable ammount of time.

Say for example, they did the 2012 ellections at the same time as the Presidential Ellections...then you would have to wait for the next Presidential Ellection before you get to change control of the Senate...which would at least mean The Government wouldnt be constantly shifting

Course you believe thats GOOD because shift avoids stagnacy...and ultimately scuppers a would-be dictator :ninja:

Course...you'd be buggered if you ever managed to lose your constitution...thats what I most fear...what would happen if your Government could either change the Constitution whenever it wanted to (like Common Law) OR aggree not to follow it all together. :sad:

Revolution my friend and I'd be on the front line.

TexasRN
09-02-2009, 07:57 PM
Revolution my friend and I'd be on the front line.

Absolutely!!


~Amy

Tyburn
09-02-2009, 09:35 PM
Revolution my friend and I'd be on the front line.
:happydancing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pmTWVJ_pXBk :happydancing:

:laugh: can I come too :ashamed:

Honnestly, its my worst fear about US Government :unsure-1:

Crisco
09-02-2009, 09:40 PM
:happydancing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pmTWVJ_pXBk :happydancing:

:laugh: can I come too :ashamed:

Honnestly, its my worst fear about US Government :unsure-1:

Well look on the bright side if the revolution wins we could rebuild the country from scratch and fix some of its problems.

We could return to our roots and do away with all the PC garbage. The constitution will mean something again if we won.

TexasRN
09-02-2009, 09:46 PM
:happydancing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pmTWVJ_pXBk :happydancing:

:laugh: can I come too :ashamed:

Honnestly, its my worst fear about US Government :unsure-1:

Why does it worry you? I remember you were also worried about Texas seceding from the Union. I live here and it doesn't worry me at all, either issue. I think the reason a Revolution won't happen is that it very well could happen and everyone knows it.

~Amy

Tyburn
09-02-2009, 10:13 PM
Why does it worry you? I remember you were also worried about Texas seceding from the Union. I live here and it doesn't worry me at all, either issue. I think the reason a Revolution won't happen is that it very well could happen and everyone knows it.

~Amy

Well it worries me for three reasons....and they both ammount to the same issue.

Lets take Texas. Suppose she decides to go her own way, and she succeeds and flourishes...how long before other States wish to follow her? TRUST ME, if one leaves, others will begin to follow. I think that would be sad because I feel what America has is special. That leads me to my second worry, so certain landlocked States decide they want to leave also, they either try and fail triggering an economic catastrophe, or worse, they fortify and the United States falls into Civil war of a type. If this happens America will approach the International Community for help. That leaves us in an insanly awkward position. The Free States will call upon Texas to help them,, the United States will call on its allies to help them, it will be a civil war which escaltes. Plus...what happens if the United States fails, and we've been helping them...the new States system aint going to deal kindly with traitors are they! Which leads me to my third worry. The United States vanishes as a dominating force in International Politics...MANY will see it as the ultimate invite to either take advantage (places like Korea, Iran) or worse, they will see a vaccum and want to take centre stage as the new world power...which will bugger up everything from our fincancial economy, to our military safety...because Islam, or China, or Russia will want to succeed.

Our fates are tied...if America goes under, she'll bring the rest of the Western World down with her.

The same applies to the loss of the Consitution, except then America could actually be the antagonist and noone would be able to stop her. Nationalism at home is fine...but Nationalism outside of ones own country is Fascism. IF The United States decided it was the be all and end all, and wished to become a collonial power...there would be little we could do to stop them. If we think about nuclear or biological weapons, then it would equally be a matter of whoever we decide to support, fascism would win, suppose we help China...then we'll all be commies, supposing we support the United States...we'd all have to bow down to America...supposing we chose Russia...no...that doesnt bear thinking about, we'd be bloody post-apokalyptic!!

So...I'd rather like America to remain exactly as she is. She is also the last major Vestege of Christondom, and its tied into her Constituional identity. Distory that and you take Christianity out of Her...but leave her with nationalism and the capability to fulfil a world wide dominance....I dont mind President Obama...but...no offence...I would want him as MY President :mellow:

TexasRN
09-02-2009, 10:23 PM
Dave, quit thinking so much! :wink: Texas will not really secede. Although if it does start to happen I'm moving back there before they close the borders. :laugh:


~Amy

mikthehick
09-02-2009, 11:09 PM
Dave, quit thinking so much! :wink: Texas will not really secede. Although if it does start to happen I'm moving back there before they close the borders. :laugh:


~Amy

Yea Dave, people who think too much tend to have stress problems and ulcers. :blink:

Tyburn
09-02-2009, 11:25 PM
Yea Dave, people who think too much tend to have stress problems and ulcers. :blink:
:sad: I do have an anxiety disorder which I'm on meds for.

I dont have any ulcers though :unsure:

Jonlion
09-02-2009, 11:26 PM
Texas will not leave the Union!!!!!!!!!!!!

Checks and balances is a term to desribe the American Governmental system, regardless of the parties, it is there to make sure no one thing/person/institution dominates.

I studied American Government and Politics at 18, and it was great fun, right when Bush was going for re-election. Good old Fillibusting, if i dig through old school stuff i can tell ya all about it.

The only issue is that sometimes your government cant get things done because they all "check" eachother.

Incidently whist dubbed the powerfullest man in the world, the President would kill for the power our Prime Minister has. If he wants somethign through, he can roughshod it through.

Trust me Americans, there are too many factors to stop Obama ruining your great nation. And besides it can be reversed by the next president.

Jonlion
09-02-2009, 11:28 PM
:sad: I do have an anxiety disorder which I'm on meds for.

I dont have any ulcers though :unsure:


We all worry Dave but Luke 12:22 says "which of you being anxious can add a single hour to his span of life"

Hard to always do but take comfort in it my brother. The lord looks after us and all these things are irrelevent.

Also, there is some great flourishes of Chritianity in China!

There is hope because as a nation it does kinda scare me!

And England will bow to no one, dont cha worry!

Remember Churchill!

TexasRN
09-02-2009, 11:29 PM
:sad: I do have an anxiety disorder which I'm on meds for.

I dont have any ulcers though :unsure:


Smile, Dave. Life's great. :happydancing:


~Amy

Tyburn
09-03-2009, 12:02 PM
We all worry Dave but Luke 12:22 says "which of you being anxious can add a single hour to his span of life"

Hard to always do but take comfort in it my brother. The lord looks after us and all these things are irrelevent.

Also, there is some great flourishes of Chritianity in China!

There is hope because as a nation it does kinda scare me!

And England will bow to no one, dont cha worry!

Remember Churchill!
:ninja: ahh yes, now I remember :laugh:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6llT2ZYg-4E :w00t:

Tyburn
09-03-2009, 12:03 PM
Smile, Dave. Life's great. :happydancing:


~Amy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFwgp-5krHc

:ashamed:

Crisco
09-03-2009, 06:00 PM
We all worry Dave but Luke 12:22 says "which of you being anxious can add a single hour to his span of life"

Hard to always do but take comfort in it my brother. The lord looks after us and all these things are irrelevent.

Also, there is some great flourishes of Chritianity in China!

There is hope because as a nation it does kinda scare me!

And England will bow to no one, dont cha worry!

Remember Churchill!

except the muslim minority :laugh: :tongue0011:

Tyburn
09-06-2009, 10:48 AM
except the muslim minority :laugh: :tongue0011:

what Muslim Minority :huh: