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View Full Version : Lesnar wishes Dean was his ref against Mir the first time around


Hughes_GOAT
02-01-2009, 08:18 PM
GSP didn't do anything i didn't think he would against Penn, except for the action on top. GSP takes anyone down but last time he just laid there against Penn. i'd like to know how the ref can warn GSP 3 times for shots to the back of the head and not do anything? what's worse is, he said he'd stand them up, no point deduction.

this is what the Lesnar fans were talking about when we said it was a BS stand up. where is the line drawn, 2 warnings? 3 warnings? and what's the deal with telling them you'll stand them up? what happened to point deduction? thank you UFC for once again showing there are no real set of rules.

bradwright
02-01-2009, 08:51 PM
GSP didn't do anything i didn't think he would against Penn, except for the action on top. GSP takes anyone down but last time he just laid there against Penn. i'd like to know how the ref can warn GSP 3 times for shots to the back of the head and not do anything? what's worse is, he said he'd stand them up, no point deduction.

this is what the Lesnar fans were talking about when we said it was a BS stand up. where is the line drawn, 2 warnings? 3 warnings? and what's the deal with telling them you'll stand them up? what happened to point deduction? thank you UFC for once again showing there are no real set of rules.


what does it really matter,,he could have stood them up and took a point away at the same time,,BJ still gets a good thrashing and loses the fight anyway.

MMeh
02-01-2009, 09:19 PM
I thought Dean handled that well. It didn't alter the course of the fight, and he maintained control of the action. Better than having a ref interject themselves and become the story any day of the week, imo

rockdawg21
02-01-2009, 09:55 PM
GSP didn't do anything i didn't think he would against Penn, except for the action on top. GSP takes anyone down but last time he just laid there against Penn. i'd like to know how the ref can warn GSP 3 times for shots to the back of the head and not do anything? what's worse is, he said he'd stand them up, no point deduction.

this is what the Lesnar fans were talking about when we said it was a BS stand up. where is the line drawn, 2 warnings? 3 warnings? and what's the deal with telling them you'll stand them up? what happened to point deduction? thank you UFC for once again showing there are no real set of rules.
:sign0011:

F34R
02-01-2009, 10:11 PM
Are you complaining about Lesnar losing? Or complaining about the very few inconsistencies in the fights?

I mean, cmon... it happens in EVERY sport when there are humans determining the outcome of a game by making decisions about a certain set of rules. It's NOT going to change. It won't EVER be 100% perfect. Unless you think you could be just that much better than these guys that do it already, I suggest you lighten up about it already. Sheesh.

County Mike
02-02-2009, 02:06 AM
For the record, UFC doesn't make the rules. It's the athletic comission of whatever state the event is being held in. I agree though, that it would be nice if the refs were more consistent but I'm not big on the "back of the head" rule when the "victim" is constantly moving into those shots.

The back of the head rule should be something like not punching the back of a head while a guy is trying to take you down. When you have the guy in mount and are trying to punch his face, but he's moving back and forth - should not apply.

Bonnie
02-02-2009, 02:30 AM
GSP didn't do anything i didn't think he would against Penn, except for the action on top. GSP takes anyone down but last time he just laid there against Penn. i'd like to know how the ref can warn GSP 3 times for shots to the back of the head and not do anything? what's worse is, he said he'd stand them up, no point deduction.

this is what the Lesnar fans were talking about when we said it was a BS stand up. where is the line drawn, 2 warnings? 3 warnings? and what's the deal with telling them you'll stand them up? what happened to point deduction? thank you UFC for once again showing there are no real set of rules.

I'm pretty sure Herb did tell him that if it happened one more time he would deduct a point.

I agree with Mike in that I don't think it was deliberate on GSP's part; I think he was trying to hit him in the side of the head, but, like Mike said it's hard missing the back when they are moving their heads like that.

I do agree with you, Goat, on the Mir/Lesnar fight. Lesnar WOULD have won that fight if Mazi hadn't stood them up like that and didn't he also deduct a point from Lesnar(?).

TexasRN
02-02-2009, 04:44 AM
For the record, UFC doesn't make the rules. It's the athletic comission of whatever state the event is being held in. I agree though, that it would be nice if the refs were more consistent but I'm not big on the "back of the head" rule when the "victim" is constantly moving into those shots.

The back of the head rule should be something like not punching the back of a head while a guy is trying to take you down. When you have the guy in mount and are trying to punch his face, but he's moving back and forth - should not apply.


I agree with you. I don't like seeing people get hit in the back of the head just due to the brain trauma it can cause BUT I also don't like that a fighter can be penalized for the other person turning their head in to those shots to take it there rather than be hit in the face or side of the head.


~Amy

Hughes_GOAT
02-02-2009, 05:15 AM
what does it really matter,,he could have stood them up and took a point away at the same time,,BJ still gets a good thrashing and loses the fight anyway.

irrelevant, you either have rules and follow them or you're corrupt.

Hughes_GOAT
02-02-2009, 05:16 AM
Are you complaining about Lesnar losing? Or complaining about the very few inconsistencies in the fights?

I mean, cmon... it happens in EVERY sport when there are humans determining the outcome of a game by making decisions about a certain set of rules. It's NOT going to change. It won't EVER be 100% perfect. Unless you think you could be just that much better than these guys that do it already, I suggest you lighten up about it already. Sheesh.

the inconsistency of the rules. and yes, i could ref better. you study the rules and apply them. Dean obviously read a different manual than Mazzagatti.

Hughes_GOAT
02-02-2009, 05:17 AM
I'm pretty sure Herb did tell him that if it happened one more time he would deduct a point.

I agree with Mike in that I don't think it was deliberate on GSP's part; I think he was trying to hit him in the side of the head, but, like Mike said it's hard missing the back when they are moving their heads like that.

I do agree with you, Goat, on the Mir/Lesnar fight. Lesnar WOULD have won that fight if Mazi hadn't stood them up like that and didn't he also deduct a point from Lesnar(?).

nah, he said he would stand them up only.:unsure-1:

i'm pretty sure Lesnar was deducted a point.

Hughes_GOAT
02-02-2009, 05:18 AM
I thought Dean handled that well. It didn't alter the course of the fight, and he maintained control of the action. Better than having a ref interject themselves and become the story any day of the week, imo

it's a rule that you can't hit behind the head, so either enforce it or don't have it.

Hughes_GOAT
02-02-2009, 05:20 AM
For the record, UFC doesn't make the rules. It's the athletic comission of whatever state the event is being held in. I agree though, that it would be nice if the refs were more consistent but I'm not big on the "back of the head" rule when the "victim" is constantly moving into those shots.

The back of the head rule should be something like not punching the back of a head while a guy is trying to take you down. When you have the guy in mount and are trying to punch his face, but he's moving back and forth - should not apply.

i agree but i hate when refs are so inconsistent. it's almost as if they're paid off. it's not hard to take a point away for multiple illegal moves. he even warned GSP at least twice for grabbing Penn's shorts, LOL.

TexasRN
02-02-2009, 05:22 AM
nah, he said he would stand them up only.:unsure-1:

i'm pretty sure Lesnar was deducted a point.


Lesnar did have a point taken away.


~Amy

Hughes_GOAT
02-02-2009, 05:28 AM
there you go :)

Bonnie
02-02-2009, 05:59 AM
nah, he said he would stand them up only.:unsure-1:

i'm pretty sure Lesnar was deducted a point.

I'm allowing that I could be wrong; but I remember Herb bending down after GSP hit Penn several times in a row on the back of the head and, I could swear, he told him if it happened again, he would deduct a point and then stand them up. Like I said, I may not be remembering it accurately; I'd have to see it again to be 100% sure. :wink:

Hughes_GOAT
02-02-2009, 06:22 AM
i can agree with that. maybe i did miss him saying he'd take a point? he did say he would stand them up.

F34R
02-02-2009, 11:18 AM
Maybe they have gotten passed all that Lesnar point deduction crap already. Maybe the AC has reviewed all that and passed new instructions down to the refs on how to handle certain situations. I can't wait to see an armchair ref actually in the ring, applying rules without making mistakes on the big stage.

Btw, I disagreed with the point deduction AND the stand up in the Lesnar fight. Until they did an interview with Mazz and he explained that he had yelled warnings out to Brock before the second attack on the back of Mirs head had commenced. He also explained WHY he infracted him, and the reasoning of the way he enforced the rules.

rockdawg21
02-02-2009, 02:04 PM
I'm allowing that I could be wrong; but I remember Herb bending down after GSP hit Penn several times in a row on the back of the head and, I could swear, he told him if it happened again, he would deduct a point and then stand them up. Like I said, I may not be remembering it accurately; I'd have to see it again to be 100% sure. :wink:
Herb said it to GSP multiple times and did nothing.

Hughes_GOAT
02-03-2009, 06:23 AM
Maybe they have gotten passed all that Lesnar point deduction crap already. Maybe the AC has reviewed all that and passed new instructions down to the refs on how to handle certain situations. I can't wait to see an armchair ref actually in the ring, applying rules without making mistakes on the big stage.

Btw, I disagreed with the point deduction AND the stand up in the Lesnar fight. Until they did an interview with Mazz and he explained that he had yelled warnings out to Brock before the second attack on the back of Mirs head had commenced. He also explained WHY he infracted him, and the reasoning of the way he enforced the rules.

yeah, i'd like to see that notice. i'm pretty sure it would be front page news on any MMA site if the rules were to change. fact is, Mazz stood him up, took a point after 1 warning. Dean allowed 3 warnings, did nothing and threatened only to stand them up, no point deduction. has nothing to do with perfect, you either have a set number of warnings or you don't.

Mazz is the worst ref in the UFC....is he still reffing? he ignored Evans beating Griffin's ass by standing behind him, pretending he didn't see what was happening. he could have stopped it there but didn't.

Hughes_GOAT
02-03-2009, 06:27 AM
Herb said it to GSP multiple times and did nothing.

he also warned him about grabbing shorts in the first. GSP hadn't had the Vaseline applied yet so he couldn't get Penn down. it's hard to push down on head and shoulders, stuffing takedowns, when your opponent is greased, LOL.

F34R
02-03-2009, 11:55 AM
You can pick and choose plenty of examples from numerous refs that have been in the UFC. That doesn't mean they are bad. It means they are human, and if they've made mistakes that bad, I would assume they were disciplined in some way, or wouldn't be still ref'ing.

Hughes_GOAT
02-04-2009, 04:44 AM
You can pick and choose plenty of examples from numerous refs that have been in the UFC. That doesn't mean they are bad. It means they are human, and if they've made mistakes that bad, I would assume they were disciplined in some way, or wouldn't be still ref'ing.

i agree in a sense. however, we're talking illegal shots to the back of the head, not something like determining if someone is finished or not. stopping a fight is judgment call. illegal shots, warnings and then penalties aren't. Tito got points taken for grabbing the cage against Rashad and that's a main reason Rashad didn't lose. Sylvia and Liddell are allowed to grab the cage at will. Mir was allowed to grab the cage against Sylvia, twice, and lock in that armbar. i guess that's karma for Sylvia? or maybe he hadn't started grabbing the cage yet? :unsure-1:

Dana thinks Mazz sucks BTW.